14:28:52 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #swbp
14:30:05 <RalphS> agenda+ TF Goals for Face-to-Face Meeting
14:30:41 <RalphS> rrsagent, please make log public
14:30:45 <RalphS> rrsagent, please make log world
14:31:08 <aliman> aliman has joined #swbp
14:31:15 <TomAdams> TomAdams has joined #swbp
14:31:37 <Tbaker> Tbaker has joined #swbp
14:32:35 <Tbaker> Is it not 14:30 UTC...?  Hello out there...?
14:32:43 <aliman> hi
14:32:51 <Tbaker> anyone else there?
14:33:01 <TomAdams> I am...
14:33:02 <aliman> I'm using passcode 7927# - have i got this right?
14:33:10 <RalphS> oops?!
14:33:19 <RalphS> that's the right code
14:33:20 <Gary> Gary has joined #swbp
14:33:26 <aliman> zakim says invalid
14:33:29 <TomAdams> Are we on the later time this week?
14:33:58 <RalphS> oops, one moment -- telecon reservation messed up
14:34:01 <RalphS> give me a minute
14:34:41 <David_Wood> David_Wood has joined #swbp
14:34:47 <MikeU> MikeU has joined #swbp
14:35:08 <jjc> jjc has joined #swbp
14:35:17 <GaryNg> GaryNg has joined #swbp
14:35:25 <MikeU> Im being told that the telecon passcode is not valid. Is there a new one?
14:35:29 <jjc> Me too
14:35:39 <Tbaker> ralph is looking into it...
14:36:19 <RalphS> zakim, this is swbp
14:36:21 <Zakim> ok, RalphS; that matches SWBPD
14:36:23 <Zakim> +Ralph
14:36:31 <RalphS> fixed now
14:36:35 <jjc> What's the code?
14:36:41 <RalphS> 7927
14:36:44 <jjc> thanks
14:37:00 <David_Wood> Thanks, Ralph!
14:37:03 <RalphS> my mistake, compounded by a systems failure last night
14:37:03 <Zakim> +Gary_Ng
14:37:09 <Zakim> +David_Wood
14:37:14 <Zakim> +??P5
14:37:16 <Zakim> +??P4
14:37:26 <Zakim> +Tom_Baker (was ??P5)
14:37:29 <Zakim> +??P3
14:37:29 <jjc> Zakim, who's on the call?
14:37:30 <Zakim> On the phone I see Ralph, Gary_Ng, David_Wood, Tom_Baker, ??P4 (muted), ??P3
14:37:35 <Zakim> +Evan_Wallace
14:37:44 <jjc> Zakim, ??P4 is jjc
14:37:44 <Zakim> +jjc; got it
14:37:51 <Zakim> +[Tucana]
14:38:00 <TomAdams> zakim, tucana is TomAdams
14:38:00 <Zakim> +TomAdams; got it
14:38:18 <Zakim> +Natasha_Noy
14:38:22 <aliman> I think I am ??p3
14:38:40 <David_Wood> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swbp-wg/2004Aug/0122.html
14:39:08 <Zakim> +??P9
14:39:26 <RalphS> zakim, ??p3 is probably Alistair
14:39:26 <Zakim> +Alistair?; got it
14:39:45 <RalphS> zakim, ??p9 is Mike_Uschold
14:39:45 <Zakim> +Mike_Uschold; got it
14:40:29 <Zakim> -Natasha_Noy
14:40:48 <Zakim> +Natasha_Noy
14:42:24 <Zakim> +Mike_Uschold.a (was Mike_Uschold)
14:42:39 <Natasha> Natasha has joined #swbp
14:43:12 <Tbaker> 431427# is mike. 431438# is Andreas.
14:43:22 <David_Wood> zakim, what is agenda?
14:43:22 <Zakim> I see 7 items remaining on the agenda:
14:43:23 <Zakim> 1. Administrivia [from RalphS]
14:43:24 <Zakim> 2. Action Item Review [from RalphS]
14:43:25 <Zakim> 3. TF Updates [from RalphS]
14:43:26 <Zakim> 4. Face-to-Face Location/Schedule [from RalphS]
14:43:27 <Zakim> 5. TF Goals for Face-to-Face Meeting [from RalphS]
14:43:28 <Zakim> 6. DAWG Request for Review [from RalphS]
14:43:29 <Zakim> 7. DIWG Request for Review [from RalphS]
14:43:33 <RalphS> Regrets: DanBri, Andreas, Libby, Guus
14:43:43 <David_Wood> Regrets:  Danbri, Deb, Guus, Andreas,  Brian
14:44:05 <RalphS> Chair: David
14:44:05 <RalphS> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swbp-wg/2004Aug/0122.html
14:44:20 <RalphS> Scribe: Tom_A
14:44:22 <TomAdams> zakim, TomAdams is scribe
14:44:22 <Zakim> +scribe; got it
14:44:39 <David_Wood> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swbp-wg/2004Aug/0096.html
14:44:41 <TomAdams> DaveW proposes to accept minutes of last telecon
14:44:54 <aliman> Zakim, mute Alistair
14:44:54 <Zakim> Alistair? should now be muted
14:45:11 <TomAdams> Resolved (minutes)
14:45:18 <TomAdams> Next telecon, later time
14:45:45 <TomAdams> Ralph's action is complete: Ralph to contact Bernard regarding Topic Maps TF
14:46:16 <TomAdams> Substance of message was "are you interested in chairing this group?", Bernard doesn't think he'll have time.
14:47:16 <RalphS> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swbp-wg/2004Sep/0003.html result w/2 votes added
14:48:02 <TomAdams> Results of first poll, lowest Y were Palo Alto & DC, Hiroshima was next lowest
14:48:14 <TomAdams> DC had a lot of probables...
14:48:18 <TomAdams> Ralph's action complete: Ralph find e-mailed f2f responses and impersonate them into the 
14:48:18 <TomAdams> straw poll
14:48:59 <TomAdams> Dave's action complete: David to ask on the mailing list whether there is an interest 
14:48:59 <TomAdams> to generate a formal response to DanC note
14:49:18 <RalphS> zakim, list participants
14:49:18 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been Ralph, Gary_Ng, David_Wood, Tom_Baker, Evan_Wallace, jjc, [Tucana], Natasha_Noy, Alistair?, Mike_Uschold, scribe
14:49:23 <TomAdams> Alan's action cont.: Alan to respond to guus' document on qualified cardinality constraints
14:49:40 <RalphS> zakim, [tucana] is Tom_Adams
14:49:40 <Zakim> sorry, RalphS, I do not recognize a party named '[tucana]'
14:49:45 <TomAdams> Natasha thinks Alan's action may have been completed...
14:49:49 <RalphS> zakim, tucana is Tom_Adams
14:49:49 <Zakim> sorry, RalphS, I do not recognize a party named 'tucana'
14:50:16 <Natasha> Alan's response:
14:50:18 <Natasha> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swbp-wg/2004Aug/0106.html
14:50:27 <TomAdams> Ralph's action complete: Ralph do an analysis of which WG participants have been able to attend at which meeting time.
14:50:44 <TomAdams> Alan's action complete: Alan to respond to guus' document on qualified cardinality constraints
14:52:26 <TomAdams> Jeremy's action ongoing: Jeremy to review XSD FNO and SCD documents, Jeremy to add XSD FNO and SCD documents to TF reference list, Jeremy to check semantics on DAWG use of XSD in abstract query model.
14:52:39 <TomAdams> May be able to get them completed in the next few weeks.
14:53:20 <aliman> Zakim, unmute Alistair
14:53:20 <Zakim> Alistair? should no longer be muted
14:53:30 <TomAdams> Tom's action (not listed) on posting about Urchin is complete.
14:54:10 <aliman> PORT - list of current proposals for changes to SKOS Core ... 
14:54:18 <aliman> links in http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swbp-wg/2004Sep/0002.html
14:54:53 <TomAdams> ? has a question on revisions, a fairly minor change in the figure, how do we revise WG
14:55:04 <David_Wood> next agendum
14:55:05 <David_Wood> next agendum
14:55:09 <TomAdams> Question for Alan, will be in Bay area shortly
14:55:41 <David_Wood> close agendum
14:55:44 <David_Wood> next agendum
14:55:50 <TomAdams> Show set inclusion relationship for healthy person, show the values. Natasha will ask Alan if he can do an update.
14:56:01 <David_Wood> close agendum 1
14:56:04 <David_Wood> next agendum
14:56:11 <David_Wood> close agendum 2
14:56:14 <David_Wood> next agendum
14:56:34 <RalphS> zakim, take up agendum 3
14:56:34 <Zakim> agendum 3. "TF Updates" taken up [from RalphS]
14:56:34 <TomAdams> MikeU, Has a comment about the notes, hasn't read in exhausting detail. Has suggestion on common use of terms. 
14:57:40 <TomAdams> Alistair is having the most trouble with the first one, would like input (see link above).
14:57:52 <TomAdams> (http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swbp-wg/2004Sep/0002.html)
14:58:00 <David_Wood> Alistair requests comments on http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-esw-thes/2004Aug/0082.html
14:58:10 <TomAdams> "Support for 'collections' of concepts."
14:58:21 <Tbaker_> Tbaker_ has joined #swbp
14:58:45 <TomAdams> Nobody from WN TF.
14:58:47 <aliman> Zakim, mute Alistair
14:58:47 <Zakim> Alistair? should now be muted
14:59:53 <Tbaker_> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swbp-wg/2004Sep/0005.html
15:01:10 <TomAdams> TomB made two posting recently, first is a proposed outline for the note (all to read and comment on), second (to members of the TF in particular) asks 6 questions, asked for responses from TF. Views the 2nd posting as a scoping draft, outline reasonable, length, scope, content in sections, etc.
15:01:41 <TomAdams> Dave would like to take comments on the mailing list, to save time...
15:02:21 <TomAdams> Comments pushed off to mailing list.
15:02:53 <TomAdams> Ben is not with us, Dave pasted the wrong link. There is progress on getting a new telecon.
15:03:16 <RalphS> -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swbp-wg/2004Aug/0075.html [HTML] next telecon for RDF-in-XHTML in early September [Ben, 2004-08-18]
15:03:42 <TomAdams> Dave has had offline discussions with Eric Miller & Jim Hendler, there is offline interest in representing RDF information in XHTML, not RDF/XML in XHTML.
15:04:18 <TomAdams> i.e. not putting triples into XHTML, but putting some other representation into the XHTML, that allows derivation of RDF by some other process.
15:04:27 <RalphS> Ralph: The HTML WG has a face-to-face meeting next week, so comments on their Metainformation Module section of the July XHTML 2.0 WD is important
15:05:38 <TomAdams> Ralph has read the draft of the metadata section of the WD. Dave has also read it, both expect to get comments independently of TF.
15:05:52 <jjc> q+
15:05:58 <TomAdams> HTML WG has offered to join us on a telecon next Tuesday.
15:07:15 <TomAdams> action: Contact Ben in regard to coordinating RDF in XHTML TF
15:07:46 <RalphS> http://www.w3.org/MarkUp/Group/2004/09/f2f/
15:07:55 <RalphS> 6-8 Sep, Edinburg
15:07:59 <RalphS> HTML WG f2f
15:08:03 <TomAdams> action 1 = Dave W to contact Ben in regard to coordinating RDF in XHTML TF
15:09:25 <TomAdams> Ralph would like to see a normative reference to RDF
15:09:36 <TomAdams> Current WG does not describe the semantics of language
15:09:42 <TomAdams> s/WG/WD
15:10:23 <TomAdams> Mark's document became XHTML WD, no RDF comments made it into the WD though...
15:11:53 <RalphS> [kudos to TomA for great work on http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/BestPractices/Tutorials ]
15:11:57 <TomAdams> Tutorial page is going ok, TomA would like more comments and links.
15:12:19 <David_Wood> Review of Second F2F poll results:
15:12:19 <David_Wood>    http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35495/2ndf2f-b/results
15:12:39 <TomAdams> Dave asked if all have voted in second poll. 
15:12:47 <RalphS> Natasha: no to both DC and Bristol
15:12:53 <TomAdams> Natasha hasn't voted, but would be NO for both locations.
15:13:16 <aliman> Zakim, unmute Alistair
15:13:16 <Zakim> Alistair? should no longer be muted
15:13:18 <RalphS> Gary: yes to DC no to Bristol
15:13:25 <TomAdams> Gary may not have been able to vote, having trouble with acct
15:14:00 <TomAdams> Yes/No/Maybe
15:14:14 <TomAdams> DC: 6/2/5
15:14:23 <TomAdams> Bristol: 6/1/6
15:14:51 <TomAdams> Bristol: 7/1/6 (Alistair just voted)
15:15:43 <TomAdams> Summary, Bristol 1 & 2 Dec, DC 25 & 26 Oct.
15:15:57 <TomAdams> DC location is in Reston, near Dulles Washington airport
15:16:39 <aliman> TomAdams Bristol 1&2 Nov right?
15:16:50 <TomAdams> Yes, sorry :)
15:17:00 <TomAdams> Summary, Bristol 1 & 2 Nov, DC 25 & 26 Oct.
15:17:03 <Tbaker_> Tbaker_ has joined #swbp
15:17:27 <TomAdams> Gary, DC yes, Bristol No.
15:17:38 <TomAdams> Bristol: 7/1/6
15:17:55 <TomAdams> DC: 6/2/6
15:18:38 <TomAdams> DC: 6/2/7
15:18:41 <TomAdams> Bristol: 8/1/6
15:19:41 <aliman> http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35495/2ndf2f-b/results?view=compact
15:20:12 <aliman> .. see summary for each person
15:20:34 <TomAdams> Dave commented, that in the chairs meetings, a note was made that we need a room that means an NDA doesn't need to be signed.
15:21:13 <TomAdams> Bristol has internet access
15:21:18 <RalphS> ah, yes, the compact view is useful too, thanks for the reminder, Alistair
15:21:29 <TomAdams> Evan thinks Bristol facilities were excellent
15:22:00 <TomAdams> WG feels confident that remote access will be taken care of.
15:22:21 <TomAdams> Dave proposes that F2F be held 1 & 2 November in Bristol.
15:22:50 <TomAdams> TomAdams has joined #swbp
15:23:11 <TomAdams> jeremy seconds on advice of Dave
15:24:17 <RalphS> Ralph: 3rd f2f should be in conjunction with the Technical Plenary in Boston 28 Feb to 4 March 2005
15:24:56 <TomAdams> Discussion cont. on locations, if F2F was held in DC, next meeting is in Boston.
15:25:14 <TomAdams> Dave would like to resolve the issue, but is uncomfortable with Guus' abscence.
15:25:31 <TomAdams> s/abscence/absence
15:25:57 <jjc> Zakim, mute jjc
15:25:57 <Zakim> jjc should now be muted
15:26:11 <David_Wood> zakim q- jjc
15:26:19 <David_Wood> q- jjc
15:26:26 <David_Wood> ack RalphS
15:26:38 <TomAdams> Ralph supports putting stake in the ground for Bristol. Required to give 8 weeks travel notice.
15:26:56 <TomAdams> The next discussion will be is there a quorum to get suitable work done.
15:28:11 <TomAdams> Natasha may not be able to call in, due to timezone.
15:28:27 <TomAdams> Deb made the suggestion that we schedule defined times for call ins.
15:28:36 <aliman> Zakim, mute Alistair
15:28:36 <Zakim> Alistair? should now be muted
15:29:16 <TomAdams> Dave wants to proceed on F2F, Ralph is comfortable.
15:29:33 <TomAdams> Resolved, F2F held 1 & 2 Nov in Bristol
15:29:50 <David_Wood> Guus' proposals:
15:29:50 <David_Wood>    http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swbp-wg/2004Aug/0109.html
15:30:58 <RalphS> zakim, move to next agendum
15:30:58 <Zakim> agendum 4. "Face-to-Face Location/Schedule" taken up [from RalphS]
15:31:03 <RalphS> zakim, close agendum 4
15:31:03 <Zakim> agendum 4 closed
15:31:04 <Zakim> I see 3 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
15:31:05 <Zakim> 5. TF Goals for Face-to-Face Meeting [from RalphS]
15:31:11 <RalphS> zakim, move to agendum 5
15:31:12 <Zakim> I don't understand 'move to agendum 5', RalphS
15:31:17 <RalphS> zakim, take up agendum 5
15:31:17 <Zakim> agendum 5. "TF Goals for Face-to-Face Meeting" taken up [from RalphS]
15:32:36 <aliman> Zakim, unmute Alistair
15:32:36 <Zakim> Alistair? should no longer be muted
15:32:56 <Zakim> -Natasha_Noy
15:33:06 <TomAdams> Alistair thinks 8 week deadline is OK. May have other deliverables before hand.
15:33:13 <TomAdams> Wordnet skipped.
15:33:19 <jjc> Zakim, unmute jjc
15:33:19 <Zakim> jjc should no longer be muted
15:33:31 <TomAdams> Natasha will talk with Alan next week on OEP.
15:34:28 <TomAdams> Jeremy may have rough note, and adequate discussion ready for F2F. 
15:34:36 <TomAdams> Won't have draft authored for F2F.
15:34:51 <jjc> Zakim, mute jjc
15:34:51 <Zakim> jjc should now be muted
15:36:04 <RalphS> [Ralph agrees the HTML TF has a short window of opportunity; XHTML 2.0 hopes to go to last call in the next few months
15:36:06 <TomAdams> Dave thinks RDF in XHTML TF will have to do more than what Guus has defined.
15:36:25 <TomAdams> Libby is not here, no comments on ADTF.
15:36:39 <TomAdams> TomB think they'll have a first draft by F2F.
15:38:08 <RalphS> zakim, close this agendum
15:38:08 <Zakim> agendum 5 closed
15:38:09 <Zakim> I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
15:38:10 <Zakim> 6. DAWG Request for Review [from RalphS]
15:38:32 <TomAdams> Dave want to decide whether we are going to comment on DAWG
15:38:35 <RalphS> next agendum
15:38:55 <TomAdams> BanBri has responded...
15:39:02 <TomAdams> s/BanBri/DanBri
15:40:30 <RalphS> Gary: do we have a group position on querying ontologies?
15:40:31 <TomAdams> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-swbp-wg/2004Aug/0123.html
15:41:19 <TomAdams> Part of Dave's unstated question is if any people are likely to look at the request, do they think there is likely to be a WG response or not.
15:42:03 <jjc> Zakim, unmute jjc
15:42:03 <Zakim> jjc should no longer be muted
15:43:52 <Tbaker__> Tbaker__ has joined #swbp
15:45:14 <aliman> Zakim, mute Alistair
15:45:14 <Zakim> Alistair? should now be muted
15:45:38 <TomAdams> Jeremy thinks that it is relevant for this WG to address the work of other WGs, where relevant to best practices
15:46:36 <TomAdams> Gary will volunteer to look at DAWG work
15:47:54 <TomAdams> action: Gary to look at DAWG's request and post comments to mailing list
15:48:24 <TomAdams> Based on comments to Gary's comments, BP WG will review, and perhaps send comments back to DAWG 
15:49:14 <TomAdams> DAWG UC&R editors draft: http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/UseCases
15:50:40 <TomAdams> Dave would like to get someone to review the original request for comments on the DIWG
15:51:17 <TomAdams> Dave will continue action onto next telecon
15:51:26 <TomAdams> if no action then, we will drop it, and not have comments.
15:51:44 <Zakim> -Evan_Wallace
15:51:47 <Zakim> -Mike_Uschold.a
15:51:48 <Zakim> -jjc
15:51:49 <aliman> bye everyone!
15:51:53 <Zakim> -Tom_Baker
15:51:58 <RalphS> rrsagent, please make log world-visible
15:52:13 <Zakim> -Gary_Ng
15:52:13 <David_Wood> Thanks, all.
15:52:48 <RalphS> rrsagent, pointer?
15:52:48 <RRSAgent> See http://www.w3.org/2004/09/02-swbp-irc#T15-52-48
15:55:58 <TomAdams> bye
15:58:02 <Zakim> -Ralph
15:58:03 <Zakim> -Alistair?
15:58:04 <Zakim> -David_Wood
15:58:08 <Zakim> -scribe
15:58:09 <Zakim> SWBPD has ended
15:58:10 <Zakim> Attendees were Ralph, Gary_Ng, David_Wood, Tom_Baker, Evan_Wallace, jjc, [Tucana], Natasha_Noy, Alistair?, Mike_Uschold, scribe
16:05:24 <RalphS> rrsagent, bye
16:05:24 <RRSAgent> I see 2 open action items:
16:05:24 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Dave W to contact Ben in regard to coordinating RDF in XHTML TF [1]
16:05:24 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2004/09/02-swbp-irc#T15-07-15
16:05:24 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Gary to look at DAWG's request and post comments to mailing list [2]
16:05:24 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2004/09/02-swbp-irc#T15-47-54