IRC log of dawg on 2004-08-31

Timestamps are in UTC.

14:28:33 [RRSAgent]

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14:28:51 [kendall]

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14:28:57 [AndyS]

As the doc is now, the syntax works (I hope!)

14:29:06 [AndyS]

That includes nesting

14:29:17 [JanneS]

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14:29:26 [DanC]

the syntax works iff the WG says the syntax works. And WG members seem to be saying otherwise.

14:29:27 [AndyS]

If we want to change it all later then fine but not piece meal and original BRQL does not work

14:29:29 [Zakim]

+??P21

14:29:53 [DanC]

why not piece meal?

14:29:57 [Zakim]

+??P22

14:30:11 [Zakim]

+ +61.7.372.0.aaaa

14:30:16 [Zakim]

+Kendall_Clark

14:30:17 [AndyS]

The Q at the moment is constrainst - separate or with graph pattern.

14:30:32 [DanC]

that's one Q. I see others.

14:30:34 [kendall]

AndyS: is there an example of each option somewhere I can look at?

14:30:48 [Zakim]

+DanC

14:30:48 [JanneS]

Zakim, +??P21 is JanneSSS

14:30:48 [Zakim]

sorry, JanneS, I do not recognize a party named '+??P21'

14:30:52 [kendall]

(each option: separate constraints or constraints witih graph patterns)

14:31:03 [JanneS]

Zakim, ??P21 is JanneS

14:31:03 [Zakim]

+JanneS; got it

14:31:14 [AndyS]

The doc has one nested example in the doc. {} style

14:31:30 [AlbertoR]

zakim, agenda?

14:31:30 [Zakim]

I see 6 items remaining on the agenda:

14:31:31 [Zakim]

1. Convene, take roll, review record, agenda http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004JulSep/0372.html [from DanC]

14:31:34 [Zakim]

2. ftf logistics [from DanC]

14:31:35 [Zakim]

3. starting another BRQL spec walkthru http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/rq23/ [from DanC]

14:31:37 [Zakim]

4. Use Cases & Requirements publication [from DanC]

14:31:38 [Zakim]

5. ftf agenda [from DanC]

14:31:39 [Zakim]

6. SOURCE, "provenance"/data-management [from DanC]

14:31:48 [DanC]

Zakim, take up agendum 1

14:31:48 [Zakim]

agendum 1. "Convene, take roll, review record, agenda http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004JulSep/0372.html" taken up [from DanC]

14:32:10 [DanC]

roll from http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/#who

14:32:27 [rob]

rob has joined #dawg

14:32:34 [Zakim]

+RobS

14:32:40 [DanC]

Zakim, who's on the phone?

14:32:40 [Zakim]

On the phone I see Kevin, Yoshio, AndyS, [ASemantics], JanneS, ??P22, +61.7.372.0.aaaa, Kendall_Clark, DanC, RobS

14:33:44 [Zakim]

+JosD

14:36:49 [AlbertoR]

DanC polling 3rdf2f attendance http://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35463/DAWGf2f3/results

14:37:25 [HiroyukiS]

HiroyukiS is s

14:37:47 [DanC]

no answer re ftf from Enrico, BryanT, Baget, Farrukh Najmi, Pat Hayes

14:37:48 [AlbertoR]

HiroyukiS not attending f2f

14:37:57 [DanC]

no answer re ftf from Enrico, BryanT, Baget, Farrukh Najmi, Pat Hayes, Hendler

14:38:04 [HiroyukiS]

* HiroyukiS is also one of the unidentified people

14:38:50 [AlbertoR]

previous meeting records http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004JulSep/0371.html approved as amended

14:39:31 [Yoshio]

* water?

14:39:32 [AlbertoR]

next telecon 2004-09-07 scriber SimonR

14:40:03 [AlbertoR]

5 actions were continued

14:40:12 [AlbertoR]

as reported into agenda

14:41:07 [DanC]

Zakim, next agendum

14:41:07 [Zakim]

agendum 2. "ftf logistics" taken up [from DanC]

14:41:09 [AlbertoR]

today telecon will last 60 minutes (till 15:30 UTC)

14:41:10 [Yoshio]

*till I drop : )

14:41:35 [DanC]

DanC interested in Wed evening thingy.

14:41:46 [kendall]

+q to ask about UC&R item on agenda

14:41:55 [rob]

there's a heavy breather again

14:41:57 [kendall]

q+ to ask about UC&R item on agenda

14:42:00 [AlbertoR]

AndyS: about 3rd f2f - the possibility to have RDFIG "get together" wednesday night 15 Sept before meeting

14:42:35 [kendall]

+1

14:42:46 [DanC]

ack kendall

14:42:46 [Zakim]

kendall, you wanted to ask about UC&R item on agenda

14:43:38 [AlbertoR]

KendalK proposing to add UC&R item on agenda for f2f

14:43:44 [DanC]

Zakim, next agendum

14:43:44 [Zakim]

agendum 3. "starting another BRQL spec walkthru http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/rq23/" taken up [from DanC]

14:43:53 [DanC]

Zakim, remind us in 20 minutes to move on or something

14:43:53 [Zakim]

ok, DanC

14:44:41 [DanC]

Zakim, who is on the phone?

14:44:41 [Zakim]

On the phone I see Kevin, Yoshio, AndyS, [ASemantics], JanneS, ??P22, +61.7.372.0.aaaa, Kendall_Clark, DanC, RobS, JosD

14:44:55 [KevinW]

KevinW has joined #dawg

14:45:17 [DanC]

Zakim, aaaa is SimonR

14:45:17 [Zakim]

+SimonR; got it

14:45:21 [DanC]

Zakim, ??P22 is HiroyukiS

14:45:21 [Zakim]

+HiroyukiS; got it

14:45:26 [DanC]

Zakim, who is on the phone?

14:45:26 [Zakim]

On the phone I see Kevin, Yoshio, AndyS, [ASemantics], JanneS, HiroyukiS, SimonR, Kendall_Clark, DanC, RobS, JosD

14:45:58 [AlbertoR]

JosDR not on IRC (but telecon)

14:46:13 [DanC]

q+ to ask about 1.4

14:46:29 [DanC]

q+ danc2 to ask about 2.3

14:46:51 [AlbertoR]

poll about BRQL issues "owners"

14:47:03 [DanC]

queue=

14:47:15 [rob]

q+ to talk about remote access protocol

14:47:26 [DanC]

q+ to ask about "Bristol" in BRQL... why abstract different from title?

14:47:34 [DanC]

which part of the doc is that, rob?

14:48:16 [DanC]

q+ to suggest dropping "Document outline"

14:48:28 [DanC]

ack rob

14:48:28 [Zakim]

rob, you wanted to talk about remote access protocol

14:48:38 [SimonR]

q+ possible error in definition of triple pattern

14:48:59 [SimonR]

q+ to possible error in definition of triple pattern

14:49:09 [AlbertoR]

actually - discussion started about BRQL document itself

14:50:43 [AlbertoR]

RobS: asked about rephrasing "A remote protocol document" and not "the"

14:51:01 [DanC]

ack danc

14:51:01 [Zakim]

DanC, you wanted to ask about "Bristol" in BRQL... why abstract different from title? and to suggest dropping "Document outline"

14:51:26 [rob]

q+ to dislike most of section 5

14:51:31 [JanneS]

s/PRFEIX/PREFIX in 2.1

14:52:52 [AlbertoR]

discussion is now switched about the DAWG query language name "BRQL" and about "Bristol"

14:54:09 [DanC]

ack simon

14:54:09 [Zakim]

SimonR, you wanted to possible error in definition of triple pattern

14:54:29 [AlbertoR]

DanC suggests to shorten Document Outline - "this document describes an RDF query language..."

14:56:02 [kendall]

be nice to have an xslt to pull out the "formalism bits"

14:56:11 [AlbertoR]

SimonR: pointed out an error in the definition of triple pattern

14:56:33 [SimonR]

2.2

14:56:58 [SimonR]

Specifically, a ground triple as defined isn't always an RDF triple as claimed.

14:57:02 [AlbertoR]

SimonR: as written in section 2.2 of BRQL document

14:57:09 [DanC]

ack rob

14:57:09 [Zakim]

rob, you wanted to dislike most of section 5

14:57:21 [DanC]

q+ to suggest dropping "document outline"

14:57:58 [AlbertoR]

RobS: asking about Section 5 phrasing

15:01:02 [rob]

1 better...

15:01:17 [DanC]

Zakim, who's on the phone?

15:01:17 [Zakim]

On the phone I see Kevin, Yoshio, AndyS, [ASemantics], JanneS, HiroyukiS, SimonR, Kendall_Clark, DanC, RobS, JosD

15:01:21 [AlbertoR]

AndyS said that Section 5 migth be shorten - and refer/talk about FROM and/or SOURCE clause

15:02:55 [Zakim]

-Yoshio

15:03:08 [rob]

s/uri/uriref/ in many places in the doc

15:03:39 [Zakim]

+Yoshio

15:03:46 [AlbertoR]

Discussion about phrasing of Section 2

15:03:53 [Zakim]

DanC, you asked to be reminded at this time to move on or something

15:04:00 [AlbertoR]

"Making Simple Queries"

15:05:41 [Yoshio]

* I perfer those with examples in general, but maybe they should be presented separately

15:06:35 [AlbertoR]

Yoshio et al. noted that the two sections might be part of two distinct cases

15:06:48 [AndyS]

Rob: ack: uri vs uriref : I gather RFC 2396 update will change URI to include #ref [:-( for us]

15:07:00 [DanC]

ack danc

15:07:00 [Zakim]

DanC, you wanted to suggest dropping "document outline"

15:07:03 [kendall]

i like the merge idea, too

15:08:43 [JanneS]

AndyS, reference [5] link doesn't work

15:09:20 [Yoshio]

Is the ordering critical in function?

15:09:36 [AlbertoR]

discussion about PREFIX position - at the beginning, at the end or both

15:09:54 [Yoshio]

or just as a convention?

15:10:10 [AlbertoR]

likes both - just prefer the old/original RDQL syntax vs. N3/lisp new one

15:10:16 [AndyS]

Parsing issue for one-pass parsing

15:10:39 [SimonR]

I'd prefer there being a syntax-enforced "right" answer rather than convention, if possible.

15:10:39 [Yoshio]

what has become of "USING " in expressing prefixes

15:11:20 [AlbertoR]

KendalK: volunteerd to "own" the PREFIX issue

15:11:34 [Yoshio]

I prefer SELECT..., WHERE..., USING, but it's just my preference

15:11:35 [kendall]

KendallC

15:11:51 [AlbertoR]

s/KendalK/KendalC/

15:11:54 [DanC]

ACTION kendallc: discuss PREFIX options and propose solution in email

15:12:01 [AndyS]

For the record: DanC owes Kendall a beer

15:12:54 [Yoshio]

* Kendall with 2 l's , Alberto :)

15:15:55 [AlbertoR]

discussion continued about kinda freezing the BRQL document before the 3rd f2f for reading

15:16:48 [AlbertoR]

during next telecon a decision will be made about freezing BRQL document before 14/15 Sept

15:18:24 [DanC]

Zakim, next agendum

15:18:24 [Zakim]

agendum 4. "Use Cases & Requirements publication" taken up [from DanC]

15:18:40 [DanC]

UC&R updated http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004JulSep/0396.html

15:19:37 [AlbertoR]

KendallC: U&C was updated

15:20:34 [AlbertoR]

various misc changes as reported into email to WG

15:21:06 [rob]

rob remains against 4.2

15:21:17 [AlbertoR]

4.2 Aggregation Graphs

15:21:37 [AlbertoR]

still pending status

15:23:27 [AlbertoR]

discussion is about 4.2 vs. 4.5 ("Querying multiple Sources")

15:24:54 [AlbertoR]

me emailed about FROM vs. SOURCE usage in BRQL and how both approces might be needed - http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004JulSep/0327.html

15:29:09 [AlbertoR]

SimonR and RobS further discussed about 4.5 and if the "aggregated"/multiple sources issue is out of the charter

15:30:37 [AlbertoR]

meetign extended another 10 mins or so

15:32:06 [AlbertoR]

DanC: is the current U&C editor working document good/new enough for publication?

15:33:09 [AlbertoR]

KendallC: proposing to publish - and seconded

15:33:25 [JanneS]

I'm ok for publishing this version - I need to run now for babysitting.

15:33:41 [Zakim]

-JanneS

15:34:36 [DanC]

Zakim, next agendum

15:34:36 [Zakim]

agendum 5. "ftf agenda" taken up [from DanC]

15:35:03 [DanC]

it's due Thursday.

15:35:07 [DanC]

Zakim, next agendum

15:35:07 [Zakim]

agendum 5 was just opened, DanC

15:35:58 [DanC]

ACTION: JimH, to work with Bijan to do some sort of UDDI/Web services use case.

15:35:59 [AlbertoR]

ACTION agendum5: CONTINUED

15:36:05 [DanC]

ACTION: DaveB to repropose source in both results and restrictions.

15:36:41 [DanC]

ADJOURN.

15:36:46 [Zakim]

-RobS

15:36:52 [DanC]

alberto, anything you need to produce a record in email in the next day or so?

15:36:52 [Zakim]

-JosD

15:36:53 [AlbertoR]

ACTION AndyS to (try to) compose a test case on inferred triples - DONE - http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004JulSep/0330.html

15:36:56 [DanC]

RRSAgent, make logs world-access

15:37:00 [Zakim]

-Kevin

15:37:08 [Yoshio]

Ciao

15:37:09 [Zakim]

-[ASemantics]

15:37:10 [Zakim]

-Yoshio

15:37:12 [Zakim]

-HiroyukiS

15:37:16 [Zakim]

-Kendall_Clark

15:37:22 [Yoshio]

Yoshio has left #dawg

15:37:24 [AlbertoR]

DanC - I will draft the minutes and send to the list -

15:37:32 [DanC]

great.

15:39:02 [AlbertoR]

AlbertoR has left #dawg

15:40:18 [Zakim]

-DanC

15:42:37 [Zakim]

-SimonR

15:43:13 [SimonR]

(I'm still on IRC for at least a while.)

15:43:49 [Zakim]

-AndyS

15:43:50 [Zakim]

SW_DAWG()10:30AM has ended

15:43:51 [Zakim]

Attendees were Kevin, Yoshio, AndyS, [ASemantics], +61.7.372.0.aaaa, Kendall_Clark, DanC, JanneS, RobS, JosD, SimonR, HiroyukiS

17:07:20 [Zakim]

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