IRC log of dawg on 2004-06-01

Timestamps are in UTC.

14:04:21 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #dawg
14:04:24 [Zakim]
Zakim has joined #dawg
14:04:28 [DanC]
Zakim, this will be dawg
14:04:28 [Zakim]
ok, DanC; I see SW_DAWG()10:30AM scheduled to start in 26 minutes
14:05:29 [kendall]
kendall has joined #dawg
14:13:24 [kendall]
or something
14:16:20 [KevinW]
KevinW has joined #DAWG
14:16:47 [DanC]
kevin, are you all set to scribe today?
14:17:00 [KevinW]
14:17:35 [kendall]
i want a 64 bit PC
14:18:15 [kendall]
apropos of nothing here, :>
14:18:30 [DanC]
agenda + Convene, take roll, review record, agenda
14:18:36 [DanC]
agenda + 64 bit PC for kendall
14:18:42 [kendall]
14:18:47 [DanC]
agenda -2
14:19:09 [kendall]
awww! maybe i have some secret fans w/ deep hardware budgets who want to see a 64 bit UC&R doc?! :>
14:19:12 [kendall]
you never know!!
14:19:35 [DanC]
stranger things have happened. W3C proceeds by a sequence of miracles.
14:19:37 [howardk]
howardk has joined #dawg
14:19:44 [kendall]
14:20:00 [kendall]
or, as my granma used to say, it can't hurt to ask
14:21:17 [DanC]
agenda + Requirements, evaluating designs (ACTIONs AndyS, BrianT, EricP)
14:21:40 [DanC]
oh crud; I still haven't done anything with swh's test foo
14:21:49 [DanC]
agenda + Test materials (ACTION SteveH)
14:21:52 [Zakim]
SW_DAWG()10:30AM has now started
14:21:59 [Zakim]
14:22:08 [DanC]
agenda + Use Cases and Requirements document (ACTION EricP)
14:23:58 [AndyS]
AndyS has joined #dawg
14:27:33 [Zakim]
14:28:33 [DaveB]
DaveB has joined #dawg
14:28:56 [SteveH]
SteveH has joined #dawg
14:29:12 [Zakim]
14:29:24 [SteveH]
Zakim: P11 is SteveH
14:29:32 [Zakim]
14:29:39 [Zakim]
14:29:50 [Zakim]
14:29:52 [AndyS]
zakim, P12 is AndyS
14:29:52 [Zakim]
sorry, AndyS, I do not recognize a party named 'P12'
14:29:57 [AndyS]
zakim, ??P12 is AndyS
14:29:57 [Zakim]
+AndyS; got it
14:29:58 [JanneS]
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14:30:06 [Zakim]
14:30:10 [Zakim]
14:30:19 [rob_]
rob_ has joined #dawg
14:30:30 [JanneS]
Zakim, +??P16 is JanneS
14:30:30 [Zakim]
sorry, JanneS, I do not recognize a party named '+??P16'
14:30:46 [Zakim]
14:30:53 [SteveH]
Zakim, +??P11 is SteveH
14:30:53 [Zakim]
sorry, SteveH, I do not recognize a party named '+??P11'
14:30:55 [Zakim]
14:31:06 [SteveH]
Zakim, ??P11 is SteveH
14:31:06 [Zakim]
+SteveH; got it
14:31:13 [SteveH]
got there in the end
14:31:15 [JanneS]
Zakim, ??P16 is JanneS
14:31:15 [Zakim]
+JanneS; got it
14:31:20 [alberto]
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14:31:22 [JanneS]
14:31:32 [DaveB]
whoa, lotta noise there - somebody on a train?
14:31:48 [howardk]
hunchback whales I think
14:32:07 [Zakim]
14:32:07 [DaveB]
14:32:20 [Zakim]
14:32:28 [Zakim]
14:32:29 [Zakim]
14:32:49 [ericP]
zakim, who is here?
14:32:49 [Zakim]
On the phone I see Kevin, HowardK, SteveH, AndyS, EricP, DaveB, RobS, JanneS, Kendall_Clark, [ASemantics], DanC, ??P18
14:32:51 [Zakim]
On IRC I see alberto, rob_, JanneS, SteveH, DaveB, AndyS, howardk, KevinW, kendall, Zakim, RRSAgent, DanC, ericP
14:33:17 [Zakim]
14:33:36 [DaveB]
don't see an intro archived
14:34:11 [FarrukhNajmi]
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14:34:12 [ericP]
zakim, who is speaking?
14:34:17 [Zakim]
14:34:24 [Zakim]
ericP, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: HowardK (4%), Kendall_Clark (11%)
14:34:25 [kendall]
wow, bad static. i'm calling back.
14:34:40 [Zakim]
14:34:40 [ericP]
it's all of us, i think
14:34:57 [Zakim]
14:34:57 [ericP]
rather, we were all hearing it
14:35:45 [Sebkha]
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14:36:23 [DanC]
14:36:26 [Zakim]
14:36:33 [DanC]
Zakim, agenda?
14:36:33 [Zakim]
I see 4 items remaining on the agenda:
14:36:34 [Zakim]
1. Convene, take roll, review record, agenda [from DanC]
14:36:35 [Zakim]
2. Requirements, evaluating designs (ACTIONs AndyS, BrianT, EricP) [from DanC]
14:36:36 [Zakim]
3. Test materials (ACTION SteveH) [from DanC]
14:36:37 [Zakim]
4. Use Cases and Requirements document (ACTION EricP) [from DanC]
14:37:07 [DanC]
Zakim, take up agendum 1
14:37:07 [Zakim]
agendum 1. "Convene, take roll, review record, agenda" taken up [from DanC]
14:37:24 [JosD]
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14:37:28 [Zakim]
14:39:08 [AndyS]
For the agenda: maybe requirements items we have still to go?
14:39:20 [AndyS]
Also - where do we want to be for the F2F in July?
14:39:27 [kendall]
yes +1
14:39:29 [DanC]
agenda + requirements: review pending
14:40:00 [thompsonbry]
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14:40:02 [DanC]
agenda + July ftf update
14:40:07 [thompsonbry]
Sorry I'm late.
14:40:15 [kendall]
ever again?
14:40:42 [AndyS]
Actually, I meant where in the technical work we want to be by the F2F - not physcially located!
14:40:50 [DaveB]
DanC: you missed Profium
14:40:54 [Zakim]
14:41:17 [kendall]
v. loud typing
14:41:19 [rob_]
the f2f item might amount to no more than an action for Rob to post a web page somewhere...
14:42:26 [kendall]
Yoshio sends regrets; feeling sick.
14:42:30 [DanC]
minutes 2004-05-25
14:42:58 [KevinW]
minutes 2004-05-25 accepted
14:43:36 [DanC]
Zakim, close this item
14:43:36 [Zakim]
agendum 1 closed
14:43:37 [Zakim]
I see 5 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
14:43:38 [Zakim]
2. Requirements, evaluating designs (ACTIONs AndyS, BrianT, EricP) [from DanC]
14:43:40 [DanC]
Zakim, take up agendum 6
14:43:40 [Zakim]
agendum 6. "July ftf update" taken up [from DanC]
14:44:04 [KevinW]
rollcall: JD, AR, KC, RS, BT, FN, SR, DB, DC, JS, SH, HK, EP, DC, AS, KW
14:45:20 [KevinW]
EP rqst headcount for july F2F.
14:45:39 [KevinW]
EP: to set up registration for july f2f
14:45:44 [thompsonbry]
Is there a URI for the current F2F schedule and details on the next f2f meeting time & location?
14:45:55 [FarrukhNajmi]
f2f is still July 15-15?
14:46:00 [kendall]
+1 hotel recs
14:46:12 [FarrukhNajmi]
It look like I will be unable to attend f2f due to unavoidable conflicts.
14:46:22 [DanC]
"14-15 July 2004 California
14:46:22 [DanC]
Network Inference to host a meeting" --
14:46:47 [KevinW]
f2f will be two full days, july 14-15
14:47:03 [SimonR]
I'm definitely going to be able to attend -- I'll be travelling in the US all through July.
14:47:21 [DanC]
Zakim, close this agendum
14:47:21 [Zakim]
agendum 6 closed
14:47:22 [Zakim]
I see 4 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
14:47:23 [Zakim]
2. Requirements, evaluating designs (ACTIONs AndyS, BrianT, EricP) [from DanC]
14:47:30 [KevinW]
action: RS to set up hosting page for f2f
14:48:02 [DanC]
Zakim, next agendum
14:48:02 [Zakim]
agendum 2. "Requirements, evaluating designs (ACTIONs AndyS, BrianT, EricP)" taken up [from DanC]
14:48:05 [rob_]
can we get an action on setting up a poll for who will be at f2f?
14:48:06 [kendall]
dan == patton -1!
14:50:00 [DanC] ACTION: writeup of joseki in response to action taken at last DAW G telcon.
14:50:08 [kendall]
zakim, mute me
14:50:08 [Zakim]
Kendall_Clark should now be muted
14:53:27 [kendall]
zakim, unmute me
14:53:27 [Zakim]
Kendall_Clark should no longer be muted
14:53:48 [KevinW]
review of joseki design eval: joseki not a query lang. is a protocol. does not support graph pattern matching.
14:53:54 [kendall]
zakim, mute me
14:53:54 [Zakim]
Kendall_Clark should now be muted
14:54:35 [kendall]
zakim, unmute me
14:54:35 [Zakim]
Kendall_Clark should no longer be muted
14:57:14 [kendall]
15:01:50 [KevinW]
action: confusion over 4.4: KC to elaborate on 4.4
15:02:22 [kendall]
is this simon speaking?
15:02:50 [kendall]
15:04:07 [DanC]
simon, we discussed this at length at the ftf; as chair, I'm trying to figure out how much replay is healthy.
15:05:04 [DanC]
a certain amount is clearly healthy since, as Rob points out, 3.4 subgraph is still "pending"
15:06:01 [KevinW]
RS: says 3.4 is unclear if query has disjunctions. will add it to 3.4
15:06:14 [kendall]
could we just drop the offending that-phrase?
15:06:44 [KevinW]
s/add it to 3.4/send to mail list/
15:09:57 [DanC]
JDBC is a protocol? really? I thought it was an API
15:09:59 [alberto]
15:10:18 [rob_]
(agreeing with Dan)
15:11:33 [thompsonbry]
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15:11:41 [thompsonbry]
15:11:42 [DanC]
ack alberto
15:13:17 [rob_]
eric, that is not your surname
15:14:10 [alberto]
fromn the Joseki Abstract text "...This document describes a simple network interface to remote RDF models. "
15:15:58 [JanneS]
me too, s/language/protocol/?
15:16:22 [SimonR]
Paragraph 3 of the UC&R seems to indicate protocol is in scope....
15:16:23 [DaveB]
well, rdql meets 3.5 - it does handle local files, software api based Qs
15:16:35 [kendall]
"It must be possible to access local RDF data -- that is, ..." -- is the way I'd change this in a new revision of the doc.
15:16:46 [SimonR]
Oops. Paragraph 3 of section 1, rather.
15:17:48 [DaveB]
15:18:24 [alberto]
our implementation (and Jena / Joseki too I think) supports local & remote RDF data rep. - I guees most of the others - which is local and remote
15:18:28 [DanC]
(kendall, the WG decision was exact on the words, I think; I haven't finished mining the record. but clearly we need to reopen the decision)
15:18:47 [kendall]
fair enough
15:19:48 [DaveB]
15:21:11 [alberto]
e.g. select ?foo from URL.rdf .....
15:23:10 [FarrukhNajmi]
Which 2 things orthogonbal?
15:23:24 [SteveH]
protocol and query language
15:23:51 [DaveB]
15:24:20 [kendall]
i don't want to change 3.5.
15:24:21 [DanC]
ack dave
15:24:25 [FarrukhNajmi]
15:24:37 [DaveB]
15:24:42 [DanC]
ack FarrukhNajmi
15:25:49 [DanC]
hmm... maybe I can get used to questions to the group... hmm...
15:27:16 [DaveB]
local - from a file or addressing an implict graph, such as via a software API
15:27:31 [DanC]
JanneS, perhaps BXXP
15:28:15 [AndyS]
local => same OS process as well (i.e. in-memory)
15:28:24 [SimonR]
I've actually implemented BEEP transport for RDF queries. I'm rather fond of it, but I don't expect it's popular enough to convince other people to like it. :)
15:28:26 [alberto]
daveb: local URIs like file:////Users/foo/rdfs/myfile.rdf vs. jdbc:// or something - what is a remote URL then?
15:28:39 [kendall]
SimonR: URI for that work/docs/paper?
15:28:43 [kendall]
i'm v. interested in that
15:29:25 [rob__]
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15:29:39 [DaveB]
+1 what AndyS says
15:29:43 [SimonR]
kendall: It's not solid enough to show around yet, unfortunately. It's hidden inside the CVS on
15:29:56 [kendall]
SimonR: thx
15:30:11 [alberto]
daveB: ok cleaer now - thanks
15:31:46 [KevinW]
action: BT to draft possible new requirement re: "independence of protocol and query lang."
15:32:15 [kendall]
drafting about what?
15:32:46 [AndyS]
15:32:52 [DanC]
DRAFT / SeRQL evaluation
15:33:29 [AndyS]
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15:40:08 [KevinW]
DC suggests f2f mtg goal: pick a design(s) (e.g., SeRQL, RDQL, Joseki, etc.) that meets DAWG requirements
15:42:31 [KevinW]
SH to write practical experience on querying performance (bwidth efficiency)
15:42:35 [DanC]
15:46:33 [KevinW]
AS to revise SeRQL eval and resend.
15:46:42 [DanC]
ACTION EricP continues
15:46:57 [DanC]
ACTION AndyS continues
15:47:00 [DanC]
Zakim next agendum
15:47:04 [Zakim]
15:47:05 [DanC]
Zakim, next agendum
15:47:05 [Zakim]
agendum 3. "Test materials (ACTION SteveH)" taken up [from DanC]
15:47:55 [DanC]
ACTION steve continues
15:47:59 [DanC]
Zakim, next agendum
15:47:59 [Zakim]
agendum 3 was just opened, DanC
15:48:05 [DanC]
Zakim, close this agendum
15:48:05 [Zakim]
agendum 3 closed
15:48:06 [Zakim]
I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
15:48:07 [Zakim]
4. Use Cases and Requirements document (ACTION EricP) [from DanC]
15:48:10 [DanC]
Zakim, next agendum
15:48:10 [Zakim]
agendum 4. "Use Cases and Requirements document (ACTION EricP)" taken up [from DanC]
15:49:28 [DanC]
ACTION EricP continues.
15:49:46 [SteveH]
testcase queries:
15:50:35 [KevinW]
DC says UC&R publication within next day or two.
15:50:51 [DanC]
ACTION kendall: announce UC&R publication widely
15:50:56 [DanC]
Zakim, next agendum
15:50:56 [Zakim]
agendum 5. "requirements: review pending" taken up [from DanC]
15:51:40 [DanC]
Zakim, pick a scribe
15:51:40 [Zakim]
Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose JosD
15:51:54 [DanC]
15:52:07 [Zakim]
15:52:08 [Zakim]
15:52:08 [Zakim]
15:52:09 [Zakim]
15:52:10 [Zakim]
15:52:11 [Zakim]
15:52:12 [Zakim]
15:52:13 [Zakim]
15:52:14 [Zakim]
15:52:17 [alberto]
alberto has left #dawg
15:52:18 [DanC]
Zakimm, agenda?
15:52:21 [Zakim]
15:52:23 [DanC]
Zakim, agenda?
15:52:23 [Zakim]
I see 1 item remaining on the agenda:
15:52:24 [Zakim]
5. requirements: review pending [from DanC]
15:52:31 [Zakim]
15:52:31 [DanC]
Zakim, postpone 5
15:52:32 [Zakim]
I don't understand 'postpone 5', DanC
15:52:33 [Zakim]
15:52:39 [Zakim]
15:52:43 [AndyS]
AndyS has left #dawg
15:52:44 [howardk]
howardk has left #dawg
15:52:55 [DanC]
RRSAgent, make logs public
15:52:59 [DanC]
RRSAgent, make logs world-access
15:53:03 [DanC]
RRSAgent, pointer?
15:53:03 [RRSAgent]
15:53:06 [Zakim]
15:53:07 [Zakim]
SW_DAWG()10:30AM has ended
15:53:08 [Zakim]
Attendees were Kevin, HowardK, EricP, DaveB, AndyS, RobS, Kendall_Clark, [ASemantics], SteveH, JanneS, DanC, Farrukh, JosD, BryanT
15:53:12 [SteveH]
SteveH has left #dawg
15:53:20 [DanC]
Kevin, anything else you need? you'll send edited minutes to within a day or two?
15:53:59 [SimonR]
Hmm. Zakim missed me in the attendence list.
15:54:25 [DanC]
15:54:54 [SimonR]
I'll try not to hold a grudge against it. Machines never understand that anyway. :)
15:55:01 [DanC]
15:55:24 [DanC]
15:57:29 [SimonR]
[I gather it's safe to chat informally now?]
15:57:58 [DanC]
RRSAgent, stop