14:04:21 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #dawg
14:04:24 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #dawg
14:04:28 <DanC> Zakim, this will be dawg
14:04:28 <Zakim> ok, DanC; I see SW_DAWG()10:30AM scheduled to start in 26 minutes
14:05:29 <kendall> kendall has joined #dawg
14:13:24 <kendall> or something
14:16:20 <KevinW> KevinW has joined #DAWG
14:16:47 <DanC> kevin, are you all set to scribe today?
14:17:00 <KevinW> yes.
14:17:35 <kendall> i want a 64 bit PC
14:18:15 <kendall> apropos of nothing here, :>
14:18:30 <DanC> agenda + Convene, take roll, review record, agenda
14:18:36 <DanC> agenda + 64 bit PC for kendall
14:18:42 <kendall> :>
14:18:47 <DanC> agenda -2
14:19:09 <kendall> awww! maybe i have some secret fans w/ deep hardware budgets who want to see a 64 bit UC&R doc?! :>
14:19:12 <kendall> you never know!!
14:19:35 <DanC> stranger things have happened. W3C proceeds by a sequence of miracles.
14:19:37 <howardk> howardk has joined #dawg
14:19:44 <kendall> exactamente!
14:20:00 <kendall> or, as my granma used to say, it can't hurt to ask
14:21:17 <DanC> agenda + Requirements, evaluating designs (ACTIONs AndyS, BrianT, EricP)
14:21:40 <DanC> oh crud; I still haven't done anything with swh's test foo
14:21:49 <DanC> agenda + Test materials (ACTION SteveH)
14:21:52 <Zakim> SW_DAWG()10:30AM has now started
14:21:59 <Zakim> +Kevin
14:22:08 <DanC> agenda + Use Cases and Requirements document (ACTION EricP)
14:23:58 <AndyS> AndyS has joined #dawg
14:27:33 <Zakim> +HowardK
14:28:33 <DaveB> DaveB has joined #dawg
14:28:56 <SteveH> SteveH has joined #dawg
14:29:12 <Zakim> +??P11
14:29:24 <SteveH> Zakim: P11 is SteveH
14:29:32 <Zakim> +??P12
14:29:39 <Zakim> +EricP
14:29:50 <Zakim> +DaveB
14:29:52 <AndyS> zakim, P12 is AndyS
14:29:52 <Zakim> sorry, AndyS, I do not recognize a party named 'P12'
14:29:57 <AndyS> zakim, ??P12 is AndyS
14:29:57 <Zakim> +AndyS; got it
14:29:58 <JanneS> JanneS has joined #dawg
14:30:06 <Zakim> +RobS
14:30:10 <Zakim> +??P16
14:30:19 <rob_> rob_ has joined #dawg
14:30:30 <JanneS> Zakim, +??P16 is JanneS
14:30:30 <Zakim> sorry, JanneS, I do not recognize a party named '+??P16'
14:30:46 <Zakim> +Kendall_Clark
14:30:53 <SteveH> Zakim, +??P11 is SteveH
14:30:53 <Zakim> sorry, SteveH, I do not recognize a party named '+??P11'
14:30:55 <Zakim> +[ASemantics]
14:31:06 <SteveH> Zakim, ??P11 is SteveH
14:31:06 <Zakim> +SteveH; got it
14:31:13 <SteveH> got there in the end
14:31:15 <JanneS> Zakim, ??P16 is JanneS
14:31:15 <Zakim> +JanneS; got it
14:31:20 <alberto> alberto has joined #dawg
14:31:22 <JanneS> me2
14:31:32 <DaveB> whoa, lotta noise there - somebody on a train?
14:31:48 <howardk> hunchback whales I think
14:32:07 <Zakim> +DanC
14:32:07 <DaveB> lol
14:32:20 <Zakim> -DanC
14:32:28 <Zakim> +??P18
14:32:29 <Zakim> +DanC
14:32:49 <ericP> zakim, who is here?
14:32:49 <Zakim> On the phone I see Kevin, HowardK, SteveH, AndyS, EricP, DaveB, RobS, JanneS, Kendall_Clark, [ASemantics], DanC, ??P18
14:32:51 <Zakim> On IRC I see alberto, rob_, JanneS, SteveH, DaveB, AndyS, howardk, KevinW, kendall, Zakim, RRSAgent, DanC, ericP
14:33:17 <Zakim> +Farrukh
14:33:36 <DaveB> don't see an intro archived
14:34:11 <FarrukhNajmi> FarrukhNajmi has joined #dawg
14:34:12 <ericP> zakim, who is speaking?
14:34:17 <Zakim> -Kendall_Clark
14:34:24 <Zakim> ericP, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: HowardK (4%), Kendall_Clark (11%)
14:34:25 <kendall> wow, bad static. i'm calling back.
14:34:40 <Zakim> -EricP
14:34:40 <ericP> it's all of us, i think
14:34:57 <Zakim> +Kendall_Clark
14:34:57 <ericP> rather, we were all hearing it
14:35:45 <Sebkha> Sebkha has joined #dawg
14:36:23 <DanC> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/#who
14:36:26 <Zakim> +EricP
14:36:33 <DanC> Zakim, agenda?
14:36:33 <Zakim> I see 4 items remaining on the agenda:
14:36:34 <Zakim> 1. Convene, take roll, review record, agenda [from DanC]
14:36:35 <Zakim> 2. Requirements, evaluating designs (ACTIONs AndyS, BrianT, EricP) [from DanC]
14:36:36 <Zakim> 3. Test materials (ACTION SteveH) [from DanC]
14:36:37 <Zakim> 4. Use Cases and Requirements document (ACTION EricP) [from DanC]
14:37:07 <DanC> Zakim, take up agendum 1
14:37:07 <Zakim> agendum 1. "Convene, take roll, review record, agenda" taken up [from DanC]
14:37:24 <JosD> JosD has joined #dawg
14:37:28 <Zakim> +JosD
14:39:08 <AndyS> For the agenda: maybe requirements items we have still to go?
14:39:20 <AndyS> Also - where do we want to be for the F2F in July?
14:39:27 <kendall> yes +1
14:39:29 <DanC> agenda + requirements: review pending
14:40:00 <thompsonbry> thompsonbry has joined #dawg
14:40:02 <DanC> agenda + July ftf update
14:40:07 <thompsonbry> Sorry I'm late.
14:40:15 <kendall> ever again?
14:40:42 <AndyS> Actually, I meant where in the technical work we want to be by the F2F - not physcially located!
14:40:50 <DaveB> DanC: you missed Profium
14:40:54 <Zakim> +BryanT
14:41:17 <kendall> v. loud typing
14:41:19 <rob_> the f2f item might amount to no more than an action for Rob to post a web page somewhere...
14:42:26 <kendall> Yoshio sends regrets; feeling sick.
14:42:30 <DanC> minutes  2004-05-25 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004AprJun/0487.html
14:42:58 <KevinW> minutes 2004-05-25 accepted
14:43:36 <DanC> Zakim, close this item
14:43:36 <Zakim> agendum 1 closed
14:43:37 <Zakim> I see 5 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
14:43:38 <Zakim> 2. Requirements, evaluating designs (ACTIONs AndyS, BrianT, EricP) [from DanC]
14:43:40 <DanC> Zakim, take up agendum 6
14:43:40 <Zakim> agendum 6. "July ftf update" taken up [from DanC]
14:44:04 <KevinW> rollcall: JD, AR, KC, RS, BT, FN, SR, DB, DC, JS, SH, HK, EP, DC, AS, KW
14:45:20 <KevinW> EP rqst headcount for july F2F.
14:45:39 <KevinW> EP: to set up registration for july f2f
14:45:44 <thompsonbry> Is there a URI for the current F2F schedule and details on the next f2f meeting time & location?
14:45:55 <FarrukhNajmi> f2f is still July 15-15?
14:46:00 <kendall> +1 hotel recs
14:46:12 <FarrukhNajmi> It look like I will be unable to attend f2f due to unavoidable conflicts.
14:46:22 <DanC> "14-15 July 2004 California
14:46:22 <DanC>     Network Inference to host a meeting" -- http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/
14:46:47 <KevinW> f2f will be two full days, july 14-15
14:47:03 <SimonR> I'm definitely going to be able to attend -- I'll be travelling in the US all through July.
14:47:21 <DanC> Zakim, close this agendum
14:47:21 <Zakim> agendum 6 closed
14:47:22 <Zakim> I see 4 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
14:47:23 <Zakim> 2. Requirements, evaluating designs (ACTIONs AndyS, BrianT, EricP) [from DanC]
14:47:30 <KevinW> action: RS to set up hosting page for f2f
14:48:02 <DanC> Zakim, next agendum
14:48:02 <Zakim> agendum 2. "Requirements, evaluating designs (ACTIONs AndyS, BrianT, EricP)" taken up [from DanC]
14:48:05 <rob_> can we get an action on setting up a poll for who will be at f2f?
14:48:06 <kendall> dan == patton -1!
14:50:00 <DanC> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004AprJun/0489.html ACTION: writeup of joseki in response to action taken at last DAW G telcon.
14:50:08 <kendall> zakim, mute me
14:50:08 <Zakim> Kendall_Clark should now be muted
14:53:27 <kendall> zakim, unmute me
14:53:27 <Zakim> Kendall_Clark should no longer be muted
14:53:48 <KevinW> review of joseki design eval: joseki not a query lang. is a protocol. does not support graph pattern matching.
14:53:54 <kendall> zakim, mute me
14:53:54 <Zakim> Kendall_Clark should now be muted
14:54:35 <kendall> zakim, unmute me
14:54:35 <Zakim> Kendall_Clark should no longer be muted
14:57:14 <kendall> +q
15:01:50 <KevinW> action: confusion over 4.4: KC to elaborate on 4.4
15:02:22 <kendall> is this simon speaking?
15:02:50 <kendall> great
15:04:07 <DanC> simon, we discussed this at length at the ftf; as chair, I'm trying to figure out how much replay is healthy.
15:05:04 <DanC> a certain amount is clearly healthy since, as Rob points out, 3.4 subgraph is still "pending"
15:06:01 <KevinW> RS: says 3.4 is unclear if query has disjunctions. will add it to 3.4
15:06:14 <kendall> could we just drop the offending that-phrase?
15:06:44 <KevinW> s/add it to 3.4/send to mail list/
15:09:57 <DanC> JDBC is a protocol? really? I thought it was an API
15:09:59 <alberto> q+
15:10:18 <rob_> (agreeing with Dan)
15:11:33 <thompsonbry> thompsonbry has joined #dawg
15:11:41 <thompsonbry> q?
15:11:42 <DanC> ack alberto
15:13:17 <rob_> eric, that is not your surname
15:14:10 <alberto> fromn the Joseki Abstract text "...This document describes a simple network interface to remote RDF models. "
15:15:58 <JanneS> me too, s/language/protocol/?
15:16:22 <SimonR> Paragraph 3 of the UC&R seems to indicate protocol is in scope....
15:16:23 <DaveB> well, rdql meets 3.5 - it does handle local files, software api based Qs
15:16:35 <kendall> "It must be possible to access local RDF data -- that is, ..." -- is the way I'd change this in a new revision of the doc.
15:16:46 <SimonR> Oops.  Paragraph 3 of section 1, rather.
15:17:48 <DaveB> q+
15:18:24 <alberto> our implementation (and Jena / Joseki too I think) supports local & remote RDF data rep. - I guees most of the others - which is local and remote 
15:18:28 <DanC> (kendall, the WG decision was exact on the words, I think; I haven't finished mining the record. but clearly we need to reopen the decision)
15:18:47 <kendall> fair enough
15:19:48 <DaveB> q-
15:21:11 <alberto> e.g. select ?foo from URL.rdf .....
15:23:10 <FarrukhNajmi> Which 2 things orthogonbal?
15:23:24 <SteveH> protocol and query language
15:23:51 <DaveB> q+
15:24:20 <kendall> i don't want to change 3.5.
15:24:21 <DanC> ack dave
15:24:25 <FarrukhNajmi> q+
15:24:37 <DaveB> q-
15:24:42 <DanC> ack FarrukhNajmi
15:25:49 <DanC> hmm... maybe I can get used to questions to the group... hmm...
15:27:16 <DaveB> local - from a file or addressing an implict graph, such as via a software API
15:27:31 <DanC> JanneS, perhaps BXXP
15:28:15 <AndyS> local => same OS process as well (i.e. in-memory)
15:28:24 <SimonR> I've actually implemented BEEP transport for RDF queries.  I'm rather fond of it, but I don't expect it's popular enough to convince other people to like it.  :)
15:28:26 <alberto> daveb: local URIs like file:////Users/foo/rdfs/myfile.rdf vs. jdbc://mydb@foo.bar:1234 or something - what is a remote URL then?
15:28:39 <kendall> SimonR: URI for that work/docs/paper?
15:28:43 <kendall> i'm v. interested in that
15:29:25 <rob__> rob__ has joined #dawg
15:29:39 <DaveB> +1 what AndyS says
15:29:43 <SimonR> kendall: It's not solid enough to show around yet, unfortunately.  It's hidden inside the CVS on kowari.sf.net.
15:29:56 <kendall> SimonR: thx
15:30:11 <alberto> daveB: ok cleaer now - thanks
15:31:46 <KevinW> action: BT to draft possible new requirement re: "independence of protocol and query lang."
15:32:15 <kendall> drafting about what?
15:32:46 <AndyS> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004AprJun/0475.html
15:32:52 <DanC> DRAFT / SeRQL evaluation http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004AprJun/0475.html
15:33:29 <AndyS> AndyS has joined #dawg
15:40:08 <KevinW> DC suggests f2f mtg goal: pick a design(s) (e.g., SeRQL, RDQL, Joseki, etc.) that meets DAWG requirements
15:42:31 <KevinW> SH to write practical experience on querying performance (bwidth efficiency)
15:42:35 <DanC> ACTION
15:46:33 <KevinW> AS to revise SeRQL eval and resend. 
15:46:42 <DanC> ACTION EricP continues
15:46:57 <DanC> ACTION AndyS continues
15:47:00 <DanC> Zakim next agendum
15:47:04 <Zakim> -DaveB
15:47:05 <DanC> Zakim, next agendum
15:47:05 <Zakim> agendum 3. "Test materials (ACTION SteveH)" taken up [from DanC]
15:47:55 <DanC> ACTION steve continues
15:47:59 <DanC> Zakim, next agendum
15:47:59 <Zakim> agendum 3 was just opened, DanC
15:48:05 <DanC> Zakim, close this agendum
15:48:05 <Zakim> agendum 3 closed
15:48:06 <Zakim> I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
15:48:07 <Zakim> 4. Use Cases and Requirements document (ACTION EricP) [from DanC]
15:48:10 <DanC> Zakim, next agendum
15:48:10 <Zakim> agendum 4. "Use Cases and Requirements document (ACTION EricP)" taken up [from DanC]
15:49:28 <DanC> ACTION EricP continues.
15:49:46 <SteveH> testcase queries: http://www.ecs.soton.ac.uk/~swh/TestSketchCases/
15:50:35 <KevinW> DC says UC&R publication within next day or two.
15:50:51 <DanC> ACTION kendall: announce UC&R publication widely
15:50:56 <DanC> Zakim, next agendum
15:50:56 <Zakim> agendum 5. "requirements: review pending" taken up [from DanC]
15:51:40 <DanC> Zakim, pick a scribe
15:51:40 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose JosD
15:51:54 <DanC> ok
15:52:07 <Zakim> -JosD
15:52:08 <Zakim> -RobS
15:52:08 <Zakim> -DanC
15:52:09 <Zakim> -BryanT
15:52:10 <Zakim> -JanneS
15:52:11 <Zakim> -[ASemantics]
15:52:12 <Zakim> -HowardK
15:52:13 <Zakim> -Farrukh
15:52:14 <Zakim> -??P18
15:52:17 <alberto> alberto has left #dawg
15:52:18 <DanC> Zakimm, agenda?
15:52:21 <Zakim> -EricP
15:52:23 <DanC> Zakim, agenda?
15:52:23 <Zakim> I see 1 item remaining on the agenda:
15:52:24 <Zakim> 5. requirements: review pending [from DanC]
15:52:31 <Zakim> -AndyS
15:52:31 <DanC> Zakim, postpone 5
15:52:32 <Zakim> I don't understand 'postpone 5', DanC
15:52:33 <Zakim> -Kevin
15:52:39 <Zakim> -SteveH
15:52:43 <AndyS> AndyS has left #dawg
15:52:44 <howardk> howardk has left #dawg
15:52:55 <DanC> RRSAgent, make logs public
15:52:59 <DanC> RRSAgent, make logs world-access
15:53:03 <DanC> RRSAgent, pointer?
15:53:03 <RRSAgent> See http://www.w3.org/2004/06/01-dawg-irc#T15-53-03
15:53:06 <Zakim> -Kendall_Clark
15:53:07 <Zakim> SW_DAWG()10:30AM has ended
15:53:08 <Zakim> Attendees were Kevin, HowardK, EricP, DaveB, AndyS, RobS, Kendall_Clark, [ASemantics], SteveH, JanneS, DanC, Farrukh, JosD, BryanT
15:53:12 <SteveH> SteveH has left #dawg
15:53:20 <DanC> Kevin, anything else you need? you'll send edited minutes to public-rdf-dawg@w3.org within a day or two?
15:53:59 <SimonR> Hmm.  Zakim missed me in the attendence list.
15:54:25 <DanC> wierd.
15:54:54 <SimonR> I'll try not to hold a grudge against it.  Machines never understand that anyway.  :)
15:55:01 <DanC> heh
15:55:24 <DanC> hoot! http://people.w3.org/sandro/2004/dawg/700/all.html
15:57:29 <SimonR> [I gather it's safe to chat informally now?]
15:57:58 <DanC> RRSAgent, stop