IRC log of dawg on 2004-04-15

Timestamps are in UTC.

15:18:42 [RRSAgent]
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15:19:40 [DanC_]
the critical things to record are decisions and action items. It's nice if you can capture the sense of the discussion, but it's not essential.
15:19:50 [DanC_]
And there's no need to transcribe everything everybody says.
15:20:25 [DanC_]
I often look at what the scribe writes down to get a sense of what an arbitrary WG memeber understands from the discussion.
15:21:02 [DanC_]
oh... attendance is also fairly critical.
15:21:21 [Jeff]
OK
15:21:38 [DanC_]
i.e. it's important that the record show the attendance. It's not critical that you get it 100% right: the rest of the WG is expected to review your proposed record.
15:21:40 [DaveB]
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15:22:32 [SteveH]
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15:23:41 [AndyS]
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15:23:48 [Zakim]
SW_DAWG()10:30AM has now started
15:23:55 [Zakim]
+Tayeb
15:24:09 [DanC_]
hmm. no ring
15:24:16 [jannes]
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15:24:21 [Zakim]
+??P17
15:24:25 [Zakim]
+DanC
15:25:29 [DanC_]
thompsonbry, dave, have you looked at the suggested talk titles in http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/ftf1 ?
15:26:21 [Zakim]
+??P34
15:27:25 [Jeff]
PHONE: Dan Connoly, Jean-François Baget, Stephen Harris?, Andy Seaborne?
15:27:31 [DanC_]
ericp, /op me , please
15:27:39 [kendall]
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15:27:41 [DanC_]
Zakim, who's on the phone?
15:27:41 [Zakim]
On the phone I see Jeff, SteveH, DanC, AndyS
15:28:15 [Zakim]
+BryanT
15:28:35 [Jeff]
Bryan Thompson
15:28:50 [kendall]
family phone call just now
15:28:54 [Zakim]
+??P44
15:29:09 [DanC_]
roger, kendall
15:29:28 [Zakim]
+PatH
15:29:42 [Zakim]
+Kevin
15:30:38 [Zakim]
+??P51
15:30:45 [DaveB]
Zakim, ??P51 is DaveB
15:30:45 [Zakim]
+DaveB; got it
15:31:03 [howardk]
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15:31:07 [patH]
patH has joined #dawg
15:31:11 [DanC_]
Zakim, who's on the phone?
15:31:11 [Zakim]
On the phone I see Jeff, SteveH, DanC, AndyS, BryanT, HowardK, PatH, Kevin, DaveB
15:31:22 [alberto]
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15:31:23 [Jeff]
Dan Connoly, Jean-François Baget, Stephen Harris, Andy Seaborne, Pat Hayes, Bryan Thompson, Kevin Wilkinson, Howard Katz, Dave Beckett
15:31:27 [Zakim]
+ +358.405.aaaa
15:31:51 [DanC_]
Zakim, who's on the phone?
15:31:51 [Zakim]
On the phone I see Jeff, SteveH, DanC, AndyS, BryanT, HowardK, PatH, Kevin, DaveB, JanneS
15:31:57 [rob]
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15:32:12 [rob]
what's the number to call in?
15:32:18 [Zakim]
+Kendall_Clark
15:32:22 [DaveB]
+1.617.761.6200
15:32:25 [DanC_]
Zakim, take up agendum 1
15:32:25 [Zakim]
agendum 1. "Convene, take roll, review record, agenda, misc actions http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004AprJun/0122.html" taken up [from DanC_]
15:32:28 [Jeff]
Dan Connoly, Jean-François Baget, Stephen Harris, Andy Seaborne, Pat Hayes, Bryan Thompson, Kevin Wilkinson, Howard Katz, Dave Beckett, Janne Saarela
15:32:31 [DaveB]
rob, then: code 7333
15:33:01 [Zakim]
+[ASemantics]
15:33:41 [Zakim]
+EricP
15:34:08 [Jeff]
ACCEPTED: to accept Minutes of RDF DAWG telcon 2004-04-08 for review http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004AprJun/0092.html
15:34:13 [DanC_]
Zakim, next agendum
15:34:13 [Zakim]
agendum 2. "Use Cases and Requirements document http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/UseCases" taken up [from DanC_]
15:34:13 [kendall]
fwiw, i just pub'd a new version of uses cases doc, 1.18.
15:34:28 [Zakim]
+RobS
15:35:58 [Zakim]
+??P13
15:36:07 [JosD]
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15:36:09 [DanC_]
Zakim, ??P13 is JosD
15:36:09 [Zakim]
+JosD; got it
15:36:14 [DanC_]
Zakim, who's on the phone?
15:36:14 [Zakim]
On the phone I see Jeff, SteveH, DanC, AndyS, BryanT, HowardK, PatH, Kevin, DaveB, JanneS, Kendall_Clark, [ASemantics], EricP, RobS, JosD
15:39:03 [Jeff]
ACTION KendallC: best-effort update of UseCases by 15 or 16 April
15:39:13 [Jeff]
"some progress, more text" come to the meeting with the document
15:40:15 [Jeff]
CONTINUE
15:40:57 [DaveB]
q+
15:40:58 [Jeff]
More use cases? Still looking through the archives
15:41:11 [dirkx]
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15:41:34 [DanC_]
ack daveb
15:42:17 [rob]
Is there no interest in the OWL use case?
15:42:22 [Jeff]
No exhaustive, use cases that I really like
15:42:24 [DanC_]
q+ robs
15:43:31 [DanC_]
ack robs
15:43:53 [Jeff]
Normalize vocabulary for requirements
15:44:37 [Jeff]
Rob: question about OWL use case [?]
15:45:14 [rob]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004AprJun/0098.html
15:45:51 [DanC_]
use case: finding employees by type (disjunction and OWL)
15:46:37 [Jeff]
How to extend RDF with other W3C tech?
15:47:26 [Jeff]
Danger: requirements linked to arbitrary examples
15:48:04 [ericP]
q+ to say you can present coder use cases from the end-user perspective
15:48:13 [Jeff]
Danger: requirements linked to arbitrary examples
15:48:44 [DanC_]
ack ericp
15:48:44 [Zakim]
ericP, you wanted to say you can present coder use cases from the end-user perspective
15:48:50 [Jeff]
Interest: Real world Domains, tools for developpers
15:49:08 [howardk]
.me asks how you can put yourself on the speaker queue.
15:49:14 [howardk]
:-)
15:49:15 [DanC_]
q+
15:49:24 [DanC_]
q+ to blather on limitlessly
15:49:27 [thompsonbry]
q+ to talk about use cases motivating protocol requirements
15:49:27 [DanC_]
ack danc
15:49:28 [Zakim]
DanC_, you wanted to blather on limitlessly
15:49:37 [ericP]
q+ to demo q-
15:49:40 [ericP]
q-
15:49:42 [rob]
larger question: where is doc for Zakim?
15:49:44 [DanC_]
ack thompsonbry
15:49:44 [Zakim]
thompsonbry, you wanted to talk about use cases motivating protocol requirements
15:50:43 [SteveH]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004AprJun/0095.html is a protocol usecase
15:51:00 [ericP]
q+
15:51:48 [howardk]
q+
15:52:49 [DanC_]
ack ericp
15:53:02 [SteveH]
limit, orderining usecase: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-dawg/2004AprJun/0096.html
15:53:42 [Jeff]
protocol use cases vs query use cases
15:53:55 [DanC_]
ack howardk
15:54:53 [Jeff]
Eric P. When will the "prose" in documents be put in "real" RDF?
15:55:45 [Jeff]
Initial RDF is fixed.
15:56:32 [Jeff]
Document: RDF Graphs for a wide audience
15:57:12 [Jeff]
Need Query against some triples
15:57:33 [ericP]
if pictures like http://www.w3.org/2003/01/21-RDF-RDB-access/OrderTracking-order1-img are useful, i can produce the efficiently
15:58:01 [Zakim]
This conference is scheduled to end in 2 minutes; 1 port must be freed
15:58:15 [kendall]
ericP: from my writerly p.o.v., that diagram is better than chunks of raw rdf-xml
15:58:22 [Jeff]
Some people have done somethng about it, no group as a whole
15:58:37 [kendall]
(and n3, turtle are better than rdf-xml too, but that's IMO)
15:59:01 [Zakim]
This conference is scheduled to end in 1 minute; 3 ports must be freed
15:59:31 [Zakim]
-DanC
16:00:01 [Zakim]
This conference is scheduled to end now; 1 port must be freed immediately
16:00:02 [Zakim]
The time reserved for this conference has been exceeded. 1 port must be freed; disconnecting the most recent arrival
16:00:04 [Zakim]
disconnecting JosD
16:00:05 [Zakim]
-JosD
16:00:07 [Jeff]
Meeting next week...
16:00:17 [DanC_]
please stand by, jos
16:00:49 [Jeff]
Diagrams, graphs vs raw RDF/XML
16:00:59 [Zakim]
+DanC
16:01:09 [ericP]
http://www.w3.org/2003/01/21-RDF-RDB-access/OrderTracking-order1-img
16:01:25 [amybbl]
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16:01:38 [amybbl]
hi
16:01:43 [amybbl]
can I have Jos' number
16:01:50 [amybbl]
redial doesn't work, I"m just getting the bridge
16:02:01 [DanC_]
jos, pls give amy your number?
16:02:05 [DaveB]
png http://www.w3.org/2003/01/21-RDF-RDB-access/OrderTracking-order1-img.png
16:02:56 [ericP]
http://www.w3.org/2001/12/attributions/Reify1-img
16:03:42 [ericP]
JOS!
16:04:45 [DanC_]
SKEE-pol? really
16:04:59 [DanC_]
evidently no.
16:05:06 [rob]
any hotels still available?
16:05:15 [Jeff]
Amsterdam meeting agenda
16:05:15 [Jeff]
see http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/ftf1
16:05:15 [Jeff]
Need info on how to go there
16:05:16 [DaveB]
I was requesting address of location on http://dawg.asemantics.com/
16:05:21 [DanC_]
Zakim, next item
16:05:21 [Zakim]
agendum 3. "Amsterdam meeting agenda http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/DataAccess/ftf1" taken up [from DanC_]
16:06:34 [JosD]
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16:07:15 [amybbl]
ok
16:07:19 [kendall]
The Golden Leeuw in The Hague
16:07:38 [Jeff]
Also, listing of availables hotels
16:07:41 [howardk]
q+ re the reading list
16:07:44 [Jeff]
Logistics page?
16:07:58 [alberto]
just log here questions about DAWF f2f meeting - I/dirk will take care of answering them - thanks
16:08:16 [DaveB]
ah yeah, that link is to the member version not the published note
16:08:17 [alberto]
s/DAWF/DAWG/
16:08:41 [DanC_]
I cited http://www.w3.org/Submission/2003/SUBM-RDQL-20031030
16:08:51 [howardk]
http://www.w3.org/Submission/2004/SUBM-RDQL-20040109/
16:08:55 [DanC_]
but I gather http://www.w3.org/Submission/2004/SUBM-RDQL-20040109/ is current
16:08:56 [DaveB]
that's member private DanC
16:09:10 [DanC_]
ok, I'll fix.
16:09:41 [amybbl]
are you dialing?
16:09:46 [amybbl]
I'm dialing you :)
16:09:48 [alberto]
1st f2f meeting logistics page is http://dawg.asemantics.com/
16:09:51 [JosD]
yes amy
16:09:52 [amybbl]
that's why I'm getting a busy
16:09:59 [amybbl]
ok, don't dial and I'll call you
16:10:18 [Zakim]
+JosD
16:10:32 [amybbl]
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16:11:07 [JosD]
oops... Amy, it's now OK thanks :)
16:11:49 [Jeff]
Titles of presentations
16:11:49 [Jeff]
Strictly 10mn / pres
16:13:30 [Jeff]
Eliminate crash course on RDQL?
16:15:29 [kendall]
patH: i was born and raised on the gulf coast, so that sounds familiar. :>
16:15:49 [alberto]
jeff - I guess we need to re-title the speech "crash course about RDQL..." to "RDQL implementation experience" or something
16:15:59 [thompsonbry]
You can reach me at: 202/462-9888 for the crash presentation.
16:16:12 [Jeff]
Know the number in advance for phone to the meeting
16:18:49 [DaveB]
& future f2f schedule?
16:20:48 [Jeff]
Proposals to host next F2Fs (date and airport)
16:20:54 [thompsonbry]
We could host in Washington, DC.
16:21:15 [kendall]
thompsonbry: ah, we could perhaps join resources for a DC meeting.
16:21:21 [thompsonbry]
sure.
16:23:00 [thompsonbry]
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16:23:06 [Zakim]
-BryanT
16:23:12 [Zakim]
-[ASemantics]
16:23:13 [Zakim]
-PatH
16:23:14 [Zakim]
-DaveB
16:23:15 [Zakim]
-JanneS
16:23:16 [Zakim]
-HowardK
16:23:17 [Zakim]
-Kevin
16:23:18 [Zakim]
-Jeff
16:23:18 [KevinW]
KevinW has left #dawg
16:23:19 [Zakim]
-DanC
16:23:19 [Zakim]
-JosD
16:23:23 [Zakim]
-RobS
16:23:29 [DaveB]
hi
16:23:30 [Zakim]
-SteveH
16:23:38 [alberto]
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16:23:54 [Zakim]
-AndyS
16:24:17 [SteveH]
SteveH has left #dawg
16:25:44 [Jeff]
Jeff has left #dawg
16:36:18 [Zakim]
-Kendall_Clark
16:36:19 [Zakim]
-EricP
16:36:20 [Zakim]
SW_DAWG()10:30AM has ended
16:36:21 [Zakim]
Attendees were DanC, Jeff, SteveH, AndyS, BryanT, HowardK, PatH, Kevin, DaveB, +358.405.aaaa, JanneS, Kendall_Clark, [ASemantics], EricP, RobS, JosD
16:36:28 [patH]
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16:38:55 [ericP]
kendall, The goal is met if the system fails to prove a proposition, or, in non-inferencing triple stores, fails to contain that proposition.
16:54:09 [DanC_]
NAF. icky.
16:54:35 [DanC_]
hmm... well, when the bounds are explicit, it can be ok.
17:04:06 [DanC_]
RRSAgent, make logs world-access
17:07:38 [kendall]
ericP: that seems fine to me
17:08:06 [ericP]
i'll tweak other bits some and commit
17:08:32 [kendall]
'k
18:34:24 [Zakim]
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