IRC log of ws-desc on 2003-06-09

Timestamps are in UTC.

16:05:49 [RRSAgent]
RRSAgent has joined #ws-desc
16:05:52 [Philippe]
agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ws-desc-state/2003Jun/0008.html
16:06:05 [Philippe]
Participants: Steve, William, Philippe, Dave
16:06:05 [sgg2]
Dave's name is David Snelling, co-chair of the OGSI working group in GGF
16:06:39 [Philippe]
http://www.w3.org/2003/Talks/0609-ogsi-serviceData/
16:07:14 [Philippe]
previous minutes: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ws-desc-state/2003Jun/att-0006/minutes-06-03.htm
16:07:23 [Philippe]
(minutes approved)
16:07:25 [Philippe]
---
16:07:42 [Philippe]
2003-06-02: Steve to check IP restrictions with OGSI
16:08:07 [Philippe]
the chairman, chairman of the GGF, agreed to post a message to the mailing list.
16:08:18 [Philippe]
GGF does not have IP claims.
16:08:49 [Philippe]
Steve will follow-up with the chairman to make sure this happens
16:09:21 [Philippe]
*done*
16:09:33 [Philippe]
2003-06-02: Steve to find a CORBA IDL expert
16:09:47 [Zakim]
+??P4
16:09:48 [Philippe]
Jeffrey Frie(sp?) will make the presentation on Corba attributes
16:09:54 [Philippe]
*done*
16:10:00 [Philippe]
Zakim, ??p4 is Umit
16:10:00 [Zakim]
+Umit; got it
16:10:14 [Philippe]
2003-06-02: Steve to get requirements from OGSI
16:10:20 [Philippe]
*ongoing*
16:10:29 [Philippe]
2003-06-02: William to get requirements from the management prospective
16:10:32 [Philippe]
*ongoing*
16:13:28 [Philippe]
Umit might have a Corba expert and bring him to the call as well
16:13:34 [Philippe]
----
16:13:40 [Philippe]
http://www.w3.org/2003/Talks/0609-ogsi-serviceData/
16:14:23 [Philippe]
http://www.w3.org/2003/Talks/0609-ogsi-serviceData/slide2-0.html
16:14:36 [Marsh]
Marsh has joined #ws-desc
16:15:33 [Philippe]
[...]
16:15:53 [Philippe]
http://www.w3.org/2003/Talks/0609-ogsi-serviceData/slide3-0.html
16:16:29 [Zakim]
+Jonathan_Marsh
16:17:53 [Philippe]
http://www.w3.org/2003/Talks/0609-ogsi-serviceData/slide4-0.html
16:21:36 [Philippe]
William: is there a machine readable to know dynamic state data elements or is it only at runtime?
16:21:42 [Philippe]
Steve: only at runtime.
16:22:26 [Philippe]
... you would need some extensions to describe them.
16:23:09 [Philippe]
Steve: there is a way to say that a data element is nillable. another technic for time constraints, ...
16:23:49 [Philippe]
nillable -> no value (data element is not available)
16:23:58 [Philippe]
Dave: you can also use minOccurs
16:24:15 [Philippe]
http://www.w3.org/2003/Talks/0609-ogsi-serviceData/slide5-0.html
16:24:35 [Philippe]
example of querying accross multiple data elements
16:26:10 [Philippe]
http://www.w3.org/2003/Talks/0609-ogsi-serviceData/slide6-0.html
16:29:21 [Philippe]
(gwsdl is an interim solution, waiting for WSDL 1.2)
16:29:27 [Philippe]
http://www.w3.org/2003/Talks/0609-ogsi-serviceData/slide7-0.html
16:30:34 [Philippe]
http://www.w3.org/2003/Talks/0609-ogsi-serviceData/slide8-0.html
16:34:21 [Philippe]
Jonathan: how do I get the XML back? is it a message?
16:34:28 [Philippe]
Steve: yes...
16:35:12 [Philippe]
Jonathan: if I want to receive them over a particular binding, how does it work? at the communication level, can you distinguish service data and operations?
16:35:22 [Philippe]
Steve: you map them to operations in fact.
16:35:56 [Philippe]
... the way it comes back is a property of the binding.
16:36:29 [Philippe]
Jonathan: "what can you just operations to do this?"
16:36:35 [Philippe]
Steve: cf slide 20
16:36:42 [Philippe]
http://www.w3.org/2003/Talks/0609-ogsi-serviceData/slide20-0.html
16:37:09 [Philippe]
s/what can you just/why can't you just use/
16:37:52 [Philippe]
William: with this solution, you won't know what are the state attributes.
16:38:01 [Philippe]
Umit: you would need extra metadata.
16:38:12 [Philippe]
Jonathan: yes, you can do that in schema for example.
16:39:03 [Philippe]
Steve: the tf will help finding the best solution...
16:39:58 [Philippe]
Jonathan: if we just want to have a get/set and a list of properties. it is kind of similar to wsdl as a whole.
16:40:26 [Philippe]
if we were only using REST, we would only use 4 operations. here, we just want predefined get/set.
16:41:10 [Philippe]
Steve: the query system is one of the best benefits to me.
16:41:31 [Philippe]
if it is not model in the interface, we need to understand where that should be model then
16:41:58 [Philippe]
agree that it seems an incongruity...
16:43:30 [Philippe]
http://www.w3.org/2003/Talks/0609-ogsi-serviceData/slide9-0.html
16:44:38 [Philippe]
http://www.w3.org/2003/Talks/0609-ogsi-serviceData/slide10-0.html
16:47:42 [Philippe]
extendable: the set of values will grow...
16:47:53 [Philippe]
mutable: the set of values can change each time
16:48:29 [Philippe]
http://www.w3.org/2003/Talks/0609-ogsi-serviceData/slide11-0.html
16:49:44 [Philippe]
http://www.w3.org/2003/Talks/0609-ogsi-serviceData/slide12-0.html
16:50:30 [Philippe]
find serviceData on interface and serviceData names
16:51:32 [Philippe]
Umit: pretty much like properties and values.
16:51:48 [Philippe]
Steve: you can model relationship between service data elements
16:52:17 [Philippe]
Steve: in OGSI , we have the notion of grid service reference, and your service data element are typed as such.
16:52:59 [Philippe]
(cf locator, factoryLocator in OGSI)
16:53:57 [Philippe]
http://www.w3.org/2003/Talks/0609-ogsi-serviceData/slide13-0.html
16:54:07 [Philippe]
http://www.w3.org/2003/Talks/0609-ogsi-serviceData/slide14-0.html
16:54:34 [Philippe]
within OGSI, all services implement the grid service portType.
17:02:06 [Philippe]
Philippe: cannot map findServiceData cannot be mapped to HTTP GEt because it takes an expression
17:02:53 [Philippe]
for attributes, you would like to set attributes using http post, and get them using http post
17:04:39 [Philippe]
http://www.w3.org/2003/Talks/0609-ogsi-serviceData/slide15-0.html
17:05:04 [Philippe]
Steve: you would need an xpath expression to do advanced query (<80 and > 60) ... didn't make it in OGSI 1.0
17:06:27 [Philippe]
http://www.w3.org/2003/Talks/0609-ogsi-serviceData/slide16-0.html
17:07:23 [Philippe]
http://www.w3.org/2003/Talks/0609-ogsi-serviceData/slide17-0.html
17:07:45 [Philippe]
http://www.w3.org/2003/Talks/0609-ogsi-serviceData/slide18-0.html
17:08:48 [Philippe]
William: slide 18 is just an example, i.e. not part of the proposal?
17:08:51 [Philippe]
Steve: correct
17:09:32 [Philippe]
---
17:09:36 [Philippe]
next steps:
17:09:46 [Philippe]
requirements from management
17:10:08 [Philippe]
next week: requirements or webDAV
17:10:38 [Philippe]
(William will try to get the requirements by Wednesday)
17:10:50 [Philippe]
[meeting adjourned]
17:10:57 [Zakim]
-William
17:10:59 [Zakim]
-Jonathan_Marsh
17:11:00 [Zakim]
-Umit
17:11:01 [Zakim]
-Steve
17:11:06 [Zakim]
-Plh
17:11:07 [Zakim]
-Dave
17:11:08 [Zakim]
WS_DescWG(tf)12:00PM has ended
17:11:13 [sgg2]
merci beaucoup encore Philippe
17:11:19 [Philippe]
you're welcome
17:13:43 [dbooth]
zakim, this is mep
17:13:43 [Zakim]
sorry, dbooth, I do not see a conference named 'mep'
17:13:49 [dbooth]
zakim, what conferences?
17:13:49 [Zakim]
I see SW_CG()1:00PM, WS_DescWG()1:00PM active
17:13:49 [Zakim]
also scheduled at this time are HTML_CG()1:00PM, XML_XSLWG()12:00PM
17:14:34 [dbooth]
zakim, this is ws_desc
17:14:34 [Zakim]
ok, dbooth
17:15:54 [Zakim]
+Jonathan_Marsh
17:16:15 [Marsh]
zakim, who's on the phone?
17:16:15 [Zakim]
On the phone I see DBooth, ??P1, Jonathan_Marsh
17:16:21 [Marsh]
Zakim, ??P1 is Umit
17:16:21 [Zakim]
+Umit; got it
17:18:01 [dbooth]
http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/ws/desc/wsdl12/meps-vs-iops/meps-vs-iops_clean.htm
17:18:17 [Scribe]
David: Let's go through the doc looking for areas that need work.
17:19:55 [dbooth]
"
17:19:56 [dbooth]
·This TF will describe pros and cons of various patterns, and make suggestions to the WG about which patterns to adopt.
17:21:36 [dbooth]
"·WG sought to decide on patterns from a larger set of patterns"
17:26:13 [dbooth]
"A WSDL service defines an interface that is potentially usable by multiple clients to interact with that Web service. "
17:27:05 [dbooth]
"The WSDL interface/portType portion of a WSD defines an abstract interface that is potentially usable by multiple clients to interact with multiple Web services. "
17:49:07 [dbooth]
[[
17:49:07 [dbooth]
7.Blue-filled circles represent nodes.
17:49:07 [dbooth]
8.A blue-filled double circle represents a Web service.
17:49:08 [dbooth]
]]
18:03:14 [Scribe]
[Scribe is failing. We're walking through the document together, cleaning up editorial and terminological questions.
18:03:16 [Scribe]
]
18:14:05 [dbooth]
"Pattern: A template for an ordered sequence of messages between nodes. Each message has a direction relative to a node. Each message, relative to a node, can either be a input, output, ifault or ofault."
18:23:20 [Zakim]
-Jonathan_Marsh
18:23:38 [Zakim]
-DBooth
18:23:38 [Zakim]
-Umit
18:23:38 [Zakim]
WS_DescWG()1:00PM has ended
18:24:57 [Scribe]
I'll try and summarize later and post it as minutes :-)
18:39:26 [Scribe]
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21:17:59 [WilliamV]
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21:55:32 [plh-lap]
rrsagent, bye
21:55:32 [RRSAgent]
I see no action items