16:52:32 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #webont
16:52:36 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #webont
16:52:40 <DanC> Zakim, this will be WEBO
16:52:40 <Zakim> ok, DanC; I see SW_WebOnt()12:00PM scheduled to start in 8 minutes
16:57:34 <jhendler> jhendler has joined #webont
16:57:39 <Zakim> SW_WebOnt()12:00PM has now started
16:57:45 <Zakim> +[UMD]
16:57:50 <jhendler> zakim, [umd] is JimH
16:57:50 <Zakim> +JimH; got it
16:58:18 <Zakim> +NickG
16:58:21 <Zakim> +Marwan_Sabbouh
16:59:41 <jjc> jjc has joined #webont
17:00:08 <Zakim> +Mike_Dean
17:00:20 <Zakim> +??P17
17:00:34 <jhendler> zakim, ??p17 is guus
17:00:34 <Zakim> +guus; got it
17:00:41 <Zakim> +??P27
17:00:51 <jhendler> zakim, ??p27 is jeremy
17:00:51 <Zakim> +jeremy; got it
17:00:55 <Zakim> +DanC
17:01:52 <Zakim> +??P29
17:01:59 <DanC> agenda + WebOnt 27Mar http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-webont-wg/2003Mar/0207.html
17:02:01 <Zakim> +M_Smith
17:02:07 <jhendler> zakim, ??p29 is ian
17:02:07 <Zakim> +ian; got it
17:02:27 <mdean> mdean has joined #webont
17:02:28 <jhendler> zakim, who is here?
17:02:28 <Zakim> On the phone I see JimH, NickG, Marwan_Sabbouh, Mike_Dean, guus, jeremy, DanC, ian, M_Smith
17:02:30 <Zakim> On IRC I see mdean, jjc, jhendler, Zakim, RRSAgent, nmg, guus, DanC, logger
17:02:39 <DanC> DanC has changed the topic to: WebOnt (http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/WebOnt/) 27 Mar. chair: JimH. scribe: Gibbins
17:02:40 <pfps> pfps has joined #webont
17:02:41 <Zakim> +??P39
17:02:50 <jhendler> zakim, ??p39 is herman
17:02:50 <Zakim> +herman; got it
17:03:18 <Zakim> +??P41
17:03:21 <baget> baget has joined #webont
17:03:31 <pfps> zakim, ??p41 is pfps
17:03:31 <Zakim> +pfps; got it
17:03:41 <Zakim> +??P42
17:03:55 <Zakim> +JeromeE
17:04:03 <jhendler> zakim, ??p42 is jos
17:04:03 <Zakim> +jos; got it
17:04:09 <DanC> I'm gonna call roll by http://www.w3.org/2000/09/dbwg/details?group=30310&order=org
17:04:15 <hth> hth has joined #webont
17:04:23 <Zakim> +??P45
17:04:32 <jhendler> zakim, ??p45 is ziv
17:04:32 <Zakim> +ziv; got it
17:04:41 <jhendler> zakim, who is here?
17:04:41 <Zakim> On the phone I see JimH, NickG, Marwan_Sabbouh, Mike_Dean, guus, jeremy, DanC, ian, M_Smith, herman, pfps, jos, JeromeE, ziv
17:04:43 <Zakim> On IRC I see hth, baget, pfps, mdean, jjc, jhendler, Zakim, RRSAgent, nmg, guus, DanC, logger
17:05:01 <JosD___> JosD___ has joined #webont
17:05:07 <Zakim> +??P46
17:05:18 <Zakim> +??P49
17:05:40 <jhendler> zakim, ??p46 philips-res
17:05:40 <Zakim> I don't understand '??p46 philips-res', jhendler
17:05:47 <jhendler> zakim, ??p49 is hori
17:05:47 <Zakim> +hori; got it
17:05:52 <jhendler> zakim, who is here?
17:05:52 <Zakim> On the phone I see JimH, NickG, Marwan_Sabbouh, Mike_Dean, guus, jeremy, DanC, ian, M_Smith, herman, pfps, jos, JeromeE, ziv, ??P46, hori
17:05:54 <Zakim> On IRC I see JosD___, hth, baget, pfps, mdean, jjc, jhendler, Zakim, RRSAgent, nmg, guus, DanC, logger
17:06:18 <JosD> JosD has joined #webont
17:07:04 <Zakim> +LynnT
17:11:26 <nmg> Proposal to accept as a true record of the March 20, 2003 telcon:
17:11:26 <nmg> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-webont-wg/2003Mar/0132.html
17:11:58 <DanC> ammendment: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-webont-wg/2003Mar/0154.html
17:11:59 <nmg> DanC: amendment from March 23
17:12:01 <nmg> url?
17:12:30 <nmg> ACCEPTED as amended
17:12:52 <nmg> 1.4 Telecon schedule
17:12:59 <nmg> - scribe for April 3: jeremy
17:13:05 <nmg> 1.3 Agenda amendments
17:13:18 <nmg> jjc: extend item 4 ;)
17:13:54 <seanb> seanb has joined #webont
17:14:01 <nmg> DanC: handling LCC, outstanding dissent?
17:14:15 <nmg> jimh: discuss in 3.4
17:14:25 <nmg> 1.5 General Action Review
17:14:33 <nmg> ACTION: DanC request review by internationalisation board of decision on
17:14:33 <nmg> datatypes.
17:14:34 <nmg> CONTINUED
17:14:59 <nmg> ACTION: chairs to include discussion of presentation syntax in next telecon. - CONTINUED
17:15:07 <nmg> 2.0  Reopening of Issue 5.26 (10 minutes)
17:15:24 <Zakim> +??P52
17:15:44 <jhendler> zakim, ??p52 is Sean
17:15:44 <Zakim> +Sean; got it
17:15:46 <nmg> jjc: B1/B2 solution generally preferred, but dropped
17:15:57 <Zakim> + +1.703.883.aaaa
17:17:20 <jhendler> zakim, aaa is obrst
17:17:20 <Zakim> sorry, jhendler, I do not recognize a party named 'aaa'
17:17:30 <DanC> zakim, aaaa is obrst
17:17:31 <Zakim> +obrst; got it
17:18:07 <nmg> jjc's objection summarised in http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-webont-wg/2003Mar/0192.html
17:18:58 <nmg> pfps: nothing new to add
17:19:01 <Massimo> Massimo has joined #webont
17:21:09 <nmg> seanb: testcases for structure-sharing would be useful
17:21:35 <nmg> jimh: two choices 1. approve B1/B2, wait for proof later. disproof would mean design change
17:22:20 <nmg> jimh: choice 2. incorrect implementations
17:22:42 <Zakim> +Massimo
17:24:35 <nmg> STRAW POLL: adopting structreu sharing seems to cause a risk that a proof be hard to find, not adopting structure sharing seems to have performance risks
17:24:56 <nmg> pfps: tricky to fix document at later date (if disproof)
17:25:09 <DanC> poll yeilded several for adopting structure sharing, one against
17:25:37 <DanC> s/performance risks/conformance risks/
17:25:49 <nmg> sorry, bad line
17:25:56 <guus> q+
17:26:33 <DanC> ack danc
17:26:33 <Zakim> DanC, you wanted to ask if this aspect of 5.26 is represented in the test spec yet
17:27:47 <nmg> guus: this is design change of language - is it really something we can push in at a leter point?
17:29:21 <guus> q-
17:30:26 <nmg> jimh: not hard to fix things (addition/removal of B1/B2) during LC period
17:32:35 <nmg> jimh: pfps, could you get us a proof by end of LC?
17:32:48 <nmg> pfps: yes, can spend the time
17:33:16 <nmg> jjc: better not to go in before LC (and then add during LC)
17:35:56 <nmg> ACTION: pfps to work on proof
17:36:34 <nmg> RESOLVED to close the issue 5.26, accepting all the points from the original docuemtn except B1,B1
17:36:40 <nmg> b1,b"
17:36:44 <nmg> B2 even
17:36:57 <nmg> jjc objects
17:37:11 <nmg> danc, obrst, deroo abstain
17:37:28 <nmg> 3.0  (60 min)  LAST CALL DECISION
17:37:34 <DanC> jjc, comments on this from HP are much more in order with you objecting
17:37:35 <nmg> 3.1 Review of Document Related Actions:
17:37:41 <DanC> (comments during last call)
17:38:39 <nmg> CTIONS: pfps, jos, smith, guus to update documents to reflect decision on datatypes - DONE
17:38:51 <nmg> ACTION: JimH to write MikeS to insert in guide some words about security and privacy issues - DONE
17:39:07 <nmg> ACTION: Chairs to contact JeffH to add ref section to req doc - DONE
17:39:50 <nmg> ACTION: JeffH to add ref section to req doc
17:40:08 <nmg> ACTION: DanC - will investigate question of adding to allDifferent list. No reply by next Tuesday (25/3) means do what he likes - DONEthat it is up to editor to 
17:40:16 <nmg> ACTION: JimH review of reference doc - DONE
17:40:33 <nmg> ACTION: pfps, Jos to add broken RDF datatype test to test suite - DONE
17:40:49 <nmg> ACTION: JimH to report to coordination group on model theory issue - DONE, later report
17:40:58 <nmg> ACTION: GuusS to update ref to reflect deprecated class being subclass of RDFS class and not OWL class - DONE
17:41:10 <nmg> ACTION: pfps to review (at least) section 8 of Ref doc. - DONE
17:41:15 <nmg> 3.2 Review of Document Status
17:41:55 <DanC> docs I found: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-webont-wg/2003Mar/0215.html
17:42:03 <DanC> Web Ontology Language (OWL) Use Cases and Requirements
17:42:03 <DanC> http://www.cse.lehigh.edu/~heflin/webont/reqdoc/index.html
17:42:03 <DanC> Wed, 26 Feb 2003 19:28:51 GMT
17:42:03 <DanC> md5sum 88aa805134ea739a95ae62a72c89bd50
17:42:05 <nmg> 3.2.1 Requirements - ready for LC (references to be added later)
17:43:04 <nmg> jimh,danc: changes from heflin agreed with danc are acceptable
17:43:17 <DanC> OWL Web Ontology Language Overview
17:43:17 <DanC> http://www.ksl.stanford.edu/people/dlm/webont/OWLOverview.htm
17:43:17 <DanC> Thu, 20 Mar 2003 19:04:49 GMT
17:43:17 <DanC> md5sum a2040620555c3e3e836a85447feab61e
17:43:24 <nmg> 3.2.2 Overview - ready for LC  (any post- LC editing changes planned?)
17:43:42 <nmg> 3.2.3 Guide - ready for LC (any post- LC editing changes planned?)
17:43:50 <DanC> OWL Web Ontology Language Guide
17:43:50 <DanC> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/WebOnt/guide-src/Guide.html
17:43:50 <DanC> Wed, 26 Mar 2003 19:31:51 GMT
17:43:50 <DanC> md5sum 0534c788afb352b2b78123e4dcadd1b8
17:44:17 <DanC> NOTE: wine.owl and food.owl also
17:44:43 <nmg> 3.2.4 References - reviewed and ready for LC (any post- LC editing changes planned?)
17:44:44 <DanC> http://www.daml.org/2002/06/webont/owl-ref-proposed OWL Web Ontology Language
17:44:44 <DanC> Reference
17:44:44 <DanC> Editor's Draft document - no W3C status at this time
17:44:44 <DanC> This version:
17:44:44 <DanC>     March 27, 2003, 12.05 EST
17:45:01 <DanC> Thu, 27 Mar 2003 17:08:36 GMT
17:46:10 <nmg> jimh: WG happy to let guus, mike, danc resolve niggles?
17:46:20 <nmg> guus: all comments incorporated - should be okay
17:46:40 <jjc> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-webont-wg/2003Mar/0229.html
17:46:40 <jjc> My msg concerning reference 7.1
17:46:41 <nmg> mike: okay with merge of changes
17:46:54 <nmg> thanks, jjc
17:47:16 <DanC> only MikeD and DanC in critical path for REF
17:47:16 <nmg> 3.2.5 Test - ready for LC (report on post LC changes planned)
17:47:22 <nmg> 3.2.6 S&AS - ready for LC?  (dependent on 2.0 outcome, plus changes planned)
17:47:31 <nmg> pfps: current version is 'as good as it gets'
17:47:38 <Raphael> Raphael has joined #webont
17:47:43 <DanC> http://www-db.research.bell-labs.com/user/pfps/owl/semantics/semantics-all.html Thu, 27 Mar 2003 15:14:11 GMT
17:48:06 <Raphael> Raphael has just joined via IRC. Will vote via Sean's telephone
17:48:20 <nmg> noted
17:49:30 <nmg> jjc: OntologyProperty issue with AS&S
17:50:42 <nmg> jjc: could be addressed during LC
17:50:55 <DanC> the WG hasn't made any decision on this. jjc's editorial suggestion hasn't been adopted by the editor
17:54:53 <DanC> [... discussion of the dependency on the RDF semantics document ...]
18:00:01 <nmg> jimh: S*AS ready for LC, adanc and pfps to put words in to reflect relationship to RDF LC semantics docs
18:00:24 <DanC> ... words *not* exclusive to datatypes.
18:00:46 <nmg> thanks
18:01:42 <nmg> 3.2.5 Test
18:02:29 <nmg> jjc: still some work to do re: datatypes (jos's action from last week)
18:03:59 <nmg> jjc: danc's outstanding request for multi-doc tests in todo section of document - in progress
18:05:02 <Zakim> -ian
18:05:24 <nmg> DanC: publish text only, link to tests?
18:05:34 <nmg> JosD: not really acceptable, happy with doc as it stands
18:07:30 <jjc> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-archive/2003Mar/att-0083/M
18:08:55 <jjc> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-archive/2003Mar/att-0083/L#FunctionalProperty-004
18:10:22 <nmg> jjc: publish test as WD at same time as LC for other docs, publish test as LC later
18:11:59 <seanb> http://www.w3.org/2002/03owlt/allValuesFrom/conclusions001.rdf
18:12:13 <seanb> claimed as Lite, but the property is not typed.....
18:12:34 <jjc> thanks sean
18:12:51 <jhendler> Proposed: to move ALL of our documents (except Test for now) to LC
18:13:00 <DanC> Thu, 27 Mar 2003 18:11:54 GMT http://www.daml.org/2002/06/webont/owl-ref-proposed
18:13:13 <DanC> ^MikeD confirms
18:14:04 <nmg> pfps abstains
18:14:20 <jhendler> Proxies in favor: Borden, Dale, Wallace, Heflin, McGuinness
18:14:59 <nmg> RESOLVED by consensus to move ALL of our documents (except Test for now) to LC
18:15:38 <nmg> 3.4 (dependent on 3.3) dates suggested by Coordination Group
18:15:49 <Raphael> Raphael has left #webont
18:16:01 <nmg> jimh: five weeks (until either 5th or 9th - to confirm)
18:17:06 <DanC> http://www.w3.org/2001/sw/WebOnt/webont-issues.html
18:18:04 <nmg> $Revision: 1.43 $ of $Date: 2003/03/27 20:29:46 $
18:19:20 <guus> Jim, just checked the SWCG record. It is May 9 as proposed end of LC
18:19:27 <nmg> DanC: 5.6, 5.17 closed over abstention
18:19:40 <nmg> DanC: no 
18:19:47 <nmg> DanC: as is 5.26
18:20:05 <nmg> DanC: no objector listed for 5.17, treat as abstention
18:20:17 <nmg> correction: 5.6, 5.17 closed over objection
18:22:28 <nmg> [handling of LC comments]
18:22:50 <nmg> pfps: RDF Core handling not useful (splitting messages into separate issues)
18:23:21 <nmg> DanC: after LC, until you hear from the chairs, do not respond on behalf of the WG
18:23:45 <nmg> ACTION: chairs to send email to WG discusssing handling of LC comments
18:23:46 <DanC> feel free to respond *explicitly not on behalf of the WG*
18:24:20 <nmg> [returning to 3.2.5]
18:25:17 <nmg> DanC: propose to publish whatever jjc gives me (by a date in consultation with jjc)
18:27:55 <nmg> [...discussion of delay in LC resease of test after other LC releases...]
18:31:12 <nmg> jjc: we should release a WD now with a note saying that we ask for implementor feedback
18:31:19 <Zakim> -obrst
18:32:23 <guus> ls
18:34:52 <nmg> 5) AOB (0-5 min)
18:34:54 <Zakim> -??P46
18:35:04 <nmg> chairs and W3c team rep thank participants for their efforts ;)
18:36:09 <Zakim> -M_Smith
18:36:10 <Zakim> -DanC
18:36:11 <Zakim> -LynnT
18:36:12 <Zakim> -ziv
18:36:13 <Zakim> -herman
18:36:13 <Zakim> -pfps
18:36:14 <Zakim> -jeremy
18:36:15 <Zakim> -jos
18:36:16 <Zakim> -NickG
18:36:18 <Zakim> -Massimo
18:36:20 <Zakim> -Sean
18:36:22 <Zakim> -hori
18:36:24 <Zakim> -Mike_Dean
18:36:26 <Zakim> -Marwan_Sabbouh
18:37:05 <seanb> seanb has left #webont
18:39:55 <Zakim> -JeromeE
18:41:19 <Zakim> -guus
18:41:20 <Zakim> -JimH
18:41:21 <Zakim> SW_WebOnt()12:00PM has ended
18:44:24 <DanC> Hi Massimo... I was thinking about asking you to help with these publications, but I didn't get around to it.
18:44:34 <DanC> Are you likely to be available tomorrow and monday to pitch in?
18:45:38 <jhendler> DanC - Guus and I will talk on Monday after CG to work out details of handling LC comments, wouldwelcome your inputs
18:46:06 <DanC> sounds good... better: ask to talk about it during CG?
18:46:30 <DanC> in either case, if you can send some thoughs to semweb-cg before monday's telcon, I expect it'll be time well spent
20:25:05 <jhendler> jhendler has joined #webont
20:27:46 <Zakim> Zakim has left #webont