Minutes for the W3C XML Protocol Working Group Wednesday, 17 January, 2001, noon PST, duration 90 minutes.
Present 40/33 Active Data Exchange Richard Martin principal Allaire Glen Daniels principal AT&T Mark Jones principal Bowstreet Alex Ceponkus alternate Canon Herve Ruellan alternate Cisco Krishna Sankar principal DaimlerChrysler R. & Tech Mario Jeckle principal Data Research Associates Mark Needleman principal DataChannel Brian Eisenberg primary DevelopMentor Martin Gudgin principal Engenia Software Eric Jenkins alternate Ericsson Research Canada Nilo Mitra principal Fujitsu Software Corporation Kazunori Iwasa principal Hewlett Packard David Ezell principal Hewlett Packard Stuart Williams alternate IBM David Fallside chair IBM John Ibbotson principal Informix Software Soumitro Tagore alternate IONA Technologies Oisin Hurley principal Library of Congress Ray Denenberg principal Microsoft Corporation Henrik Nielsen principal Mitre Marwan Sabbouh principal Mitre Paul Denning alternate Netscape Vidur Apparao principal Netscape Ray Whitmer alternate Novell Scott Isaacson principal OMG Henry Lowe principal Oracle David Clay principal Philips Research Amr Yassin alternate Rogue Wave Murali Janakiraman principal SAP AG Volker Wiechers principal SAP AG Gerd Hoelzing alternate Software AG Michael Champion principal Tibco Frank DeRose principal Unisys Lynne Thompson principal Unisys Nick Smilonich alternate Vitria Technology Inc. Waqar Sadiq principal W3C Yves Lafon team contact W3C Hugo Haas alt team contact WebMethods Randy Waldrop principal AUTOMATICALLY EXCUSED Active Data Exchange Eric Fedok alternate Allaire Simeon Simeonov alternate AT&T Michah Lerner alternate Bowstreet James Tauber principal Canon Jean-Jacques Moreau principal DaimlerChrysler R. & Tech Andreas Riegg alternate DevelopMentor Don Box alternate Engenia Software Jeffrey Kay principal Fujitsu Software Corporation Masahiko Narita alternate IBM Fransisco Cubera alternate Informix Software Charles Campbell principal IONA Technologies Eric Newcomer alternate Library of Congress Rich Greenfield alternate Microsoft Corporation Paul Cotton alternate Oracle Jim Trezzo alternate Philips Research Yasser alSafadi principal Rogue Wave Patrick Thompson alternate Software AG Dietmar Gaertner alternate Vitria Technology Inc. Richard Koo alternate Regrets Akamai Technologies Mark Nottingham principal Commerce One David Burdett principal Calico Commerce Rekha Nagarajan principal Compaq Yin-Leng Husband principal Compaq Kevin Perkins alternate Group 8760 Dick Brooks ebXML contact Intel Randy Hall principal Lotus Development Noah Mendelsohn principal Progress Software Andrew Eisenberg principal Sun Microsystems Ed Mooney principal Sun Microsystems Mark Baker alternate Xerox Bill Anderson principal XMLSolutions Kevin Mitchell principal Absent Without Explanation Commerce One Murray Maloney alternate Epicentric Bjoern Heckel principal Epicentric Dean Moses alternate Jamcracker David Orchard principal NCR Vilhelm Rosenqvist principal NCR Lew Shannon alternate Progress Software Peter Lecuyer alternate Xerox Tom Breuel alternate XMLSolutions John Evdemon alternate
Minutes: David Clay Action items: Henrik Nielsen
1. Glen Daniels - Usage scenarios for former DR 805, 807, 809, 810 (QOS, routing, tracking). Sent first draft to WG, few responses. Received QOS response from Yves Lafon and Paul Denning. Will post complete draft scenarios by end of week. 3. done 4. done 5. Henrik Nielsen - Preamble to usage scenarios. Wrote and sent out to WG for review, by end of week will decide what wording to include in editor's copy of usage scenarios. 6. done
twelve WG members volunteered to be in subgroup. Also coordinating with Hugo. Here is list of members of this subgroup:
Proposed timeline allows for 2 drafts before Boston f2f, the last to be distributed one week before the f2f: 1/22-26, subgroup discussion 1/29-2/9, subgroup work on draft 2 2/9, draft 2 to wider group for discussion 2/19, 3rd draft completed, one week before Boston f2fTo speed up process will announce activities to dist-app with agreement of chair, rather than entire WG. Hope to have subgroup f2f since several members geographically close.
Volunteer editorial team: Martin Gudgin, Henrik Nielsen, Stuart Williams, Kevin Mitchell, Brian Eisenberg, Hugo Haas Will meet separately with David Fallside to organize activities. Mission of group is to produce the actual spec. Will start with a sanitized version of the SOAP 1.1 Note which Hugo will produce. First step will be for requirements doc section leads to map requirements to SOAP 1.1 note and document issues that arise where the mapping fails. All req doc section leads signed up to do this. Henrik Nielsen noted that his Redmond f2f presentation covered some of the mapping. The issues which arise will continue to be tracked in the specification. The goal for the first generation of the specification is 2/7/2001. Nilo Mitra has agreed to be responsible for tracking use cases. Dist-app must be examined for use cases which may have been submitted which are not covered by existing use cases.
Requirements doc section leads reported that few comments have been received, and none have been received which resulted in changes to requirements. David Ezell - little discussion, no new issues. Oisin Hurley reported on a short discussion regarding extensibility and the "must understand" SOAP attribute, but no additional requirements uncovered. Mark Nottingham not present. Paul Cotton - no new comments. Vidur Aparao - no new comments. Some members expressed concern about the lack of public comment. Hugo will attempt to obtain web statistics on requirements doc. David Ezell's modified preamble text to R305 was accepted. David Ezell also will submit minor editorial change to R309 concerning memory constrained devices. David Fallside noted that section 4 now contains only accepted requirements, no draft requirements.
John Ibbotson led a discussion on some of the usage scenarios which were repackaged from the ebXML use cases submitted by Dick Brooks. DS3 and DS4 These DS's were discussed together. John described the difference as document transmission vs. RPC . It was noted by several members that these two usage scenarios might be different from the application perspective, but not necessarily from the underlying XP perspective. Henrik stated that the preamble to the the usage scenarios should make clear that XP supports but does not define programming paradigms (such as RPC). There was general agreement that DS3 and DS4 were useful, but needed clarification. John Ibbotson will rewrite by 1/18/2001. DS5 Discussion about whether the transport layer should be mentioned since XP is transport independent and this might imply a solution particular to a protocol. Discussion about the difference between an acknowledgment of receipt and a service response. It was noted that without the mention of transport, this DS might become part of DS3/4. Glen Daniels will post proposed clarification by end of day 1/18/2001. DS6 John Ibbotson described this usage scenario as an example of the requirement for XP to move application payloads unchanged. David Fallside added that XP processors need not look inside the payload. General consensus was that wording could be simplified and implementation suggestions (e.g., mime/multipart) should be omitted. Glen Daniels will send edits to dist-app. DS7 A third party service bureau operating as a proxy for one or more trading partners (multihop/multinode). It was felt that this usage scenario was unclear. John Ibbotson will talk to Dick Brooks to expand upon the wording. David Ezell stated that this DS also suggested an implementation (multihop/multinode) and that such mention should be avoided. DS8 Long running conversational message exchanges. John thought that this did not impose requirement for globally unique id, only a conversation id unique among trading partners. General consensus that this usage scenario would test the extensibility mechanisms of XP. It was suggested by David Fallside that this DS be fleshed out into more of a story. John Ibbotson will rewrite.